Boeing boeing gone (maybe)

[Tin basher]

Looks like troubled times ahead for Boeing, lawsuits, build quality issues and so on. As one of a very few large volume aviation manufacturers how much do Boeing troubles affect the whole industry? The path to civvy aviation is well trodden route for some ex service types an industry without Boeing surely not.

Boeing is reportedly facing a criminal investigation into the incident (Exit door failure) itself, as well as legal action from passengers aboard the plane.

another report into Boeing's safety culture by an expert panel found a "disconnect" between senior management and regular staff, as well as signs that staff were hesitant about reporting problems for fear of retaliation.

Some carriers may try to obtain Airbus models but a wholesale transfer of orders from the American manufacturer to the European is simply impractical....Both have very full order books. Airbus has a backlog of more than 8,000 planes and Boeing more than 6,000...............There is a potential third player. The Chinese manufacturer Comac has developed the C919, a plane designed to compete with the 737 Max and the A320 neo.

Boeing: How much trouble is the company in?

The US plane giant is under pressure from regulators and airlines, and its reputation is badly damaged.

www.bbc.co.uk

So a large legal mess, discontent on the shop floor and the Chinese potentially muscling in. What next for Boeing and its 6,000 aircraft backlog? To big to fail?

 

[Flumpdaddy]

Looks like troubled times ahead for Boeing, lawsuits, build quality issues and so on. As one of a very few large volume aviation manufacturers how much do Boeing troubles affect the whole industry? The path to civvy aviation is well trodden route for some ex service types an industry without Boeing surely not.

Boeing is reportedly facing a criminal investigation into the incident (Exit door failure) itself, as well as legal action from passengers aboard the plane.

another report into Boeing's safety culture by an expert panel found a "disconnect" between senior management and regular staff, as well as signs that staff were hesitant about reporting problems for fear of retaliation.

Some carriers may try to obtain Airbus models but a wholesale transfer of orders from the American manufacturer to the European is simply impractical....Both have very full order books. Airbus has a backlog of more than 8,000 planes and Boeing more than 6,000...............There is a potential third player. The Chinese manufacturer Comac has developed the C919, a plane designed to compete with the 737 Max and the A320 neo.

Boeing: How much trouble is the company in?

The US plane giant is under pressure from regulators and airlines, and its reputation is badly damaged.

www.bbc.co.uk

So a large legal mess, discontent on the shop floor and the Chinese potentially muscling in. What next for Boeing and its 6,000 aircraft backlog? To big to fail?

I think your last 4 words sum it up.

No one else has the capacity to soak up the orders; Airbus would need years to expand production sufficiently, and the Chinese are too big of an unknown for most operators. They may get some orders but it will be slow to build.

Boeing will suffer but the US won't allow them to die. Might be worth buying some shares whilst they are cheap - Rolls Royce were all but written off during the pandemic and they are bouncing back nicely, it's amazing what a huge existing customer base can sustain.

 

[Talk Wrench]

Boeing's problems are well documented, especially with their ill advised journey into outsourcing core functions.

One rule of governance that should never be forgotten.

"If you outsource responsibility, you outsource accountability".

Boeing will survive but only if they reshape their production capacity and insource that accountability. Bringing Spirit Aero back into the fold would be a good start.

 

[Barch]

Is it time to sell those shares?

 

[busby1971]

Saw a graph the other day that suggests that Boeing aren’t having more issues, it’s just that they are all making the news.

A couple of the recent issues were with the NG rather than Max variant, so more likely a maintenance rather than manufacturing issue.

Still think there’s some leadership behaviour issues there

 

[Fu Fu Valve]

Anything involving a Boeing will be news because they have to have something to write about and keep the story going.

There's another one today about an Alaska Airlines 737 that had a windscreen crack as it was descending. Because that's Boeing's fault obviously. Same as the hydraulic leak on a 10 year old 777 last week.

There's so many Boeings in use something going to happen every day, doesn't make them all the manufacturers fault - door blanks falling off excepted

 

[Tin basher]

Changes afoot at the Boeing top table.

"Boeing boss Dave Calhoun will leave at the end of this year amid a deepening crisis over the firm's safety record. Boeing also said that the head of its commercial airlines division will retire immediately while its chairman will not stand for re-election."

Boeing chief executive Dave Calhoun to leave as firm faces safety crisis

Dave Calhoun will leave the planemaker at end of this year amid a deepening crisis over its safety record.

www.bbc.co.uk

 

[busby1971]

And leadership change, he’ll be doing okay though on the way out

 

[Tin basher]

Is it time to sell those shares?

Potential big job cuts, belt tightening and the famous corporate re-org might be time to sell

Boeing to cut 17,000 jobs - 10% of workforce with strike on 5th week

Boeing will lay off 10% of its employees as a strike by factory workers cripples airplane production. 17,000 people will be cut as the company continues to lose money.

www.dailymail.co.uk

"Boeing plans to lay off about 10% of its workers in the coming months, about 17,000 people, as it continues to lose money and tries to deal with a strike that is crippling production of the company's best-selling airline planes."

"After a panel blew out of a Max during an Alaska Airlines flight in January. Boeing has agreed to plead guilty and pay a $243.6 million fine to avoid a criminal trial for conspiracy to commit fraud tied to the Max, but relatives of the 346 people who died in two Max crashes want tougher punishments."

Troubled times for Boeing. To big to fail??

 

[UlsterExile]

As previously said, Airbus is not able to absorb that amount of work and the Chinese !!! well there is a reason why the likes of TEMU and Shein sell their goods for peanuts. Not saying it's the same in aerospace industry but i don't think the west is ready to fly on Chinese made aircraft just yet!!!!!!!!

 

[Flumpdaddy]

Boeing had a long way to go to recover from its problems but I stand by my previous statement that they are too big to fail.

For starters, which other firm could take on the role of type authority for each variant?

Next, the US military is a huge customer of Boeing military, are they going to just let the company die and take on responsibility for the ongoing type airworthiness of hundreds of aircraft including the foreign operators?

Even after 17000 layoffs they still employ over 150000 people and a large portion are USA citizens. That combined with the money brought in by global operations of Boeing aircraft still makes it a big part of the US identity and economy and unlikely to be abandoned by the US government.

It might take a few years but they will recover from where they are now m

 

[Rigga]

Over the last few days Boeing have secured $30Billion in 'funds' possibly toward new (non-Union) manufacturing establishments...or for the 30% Pay rises being quoted?

 

[Keyser Söze]

My understanding of the various goings on at Boeing will see and end to the strike action with employees accepting a 35% pay deal (plus other benefits) this week.

As for the possible Chinese manufacturer (Comac) as an alternative? I can't see that ever gaining any traction! Not only will the FAA (for starters) not approve it, can anyone honestly understand the level of re-training that has to occur with the Pilots/FOs/ Engineering type training Crewing training/ Logistic chain reliance/ respective NAA approvals etc etc etc??

The problems at Boeing have largely centred around a toxic leadership culture, which sacrificed highly skilled and specialised aircraft personnel, employee treatment, pay, respect and team work (amongst others); in favour of cheap labour/ share holder dividends and profits - and quite simply the employees have turned around and collectively said NO! Arguably this quiet revolt is occurring in other areas of employment across the developed world.

With a strategic change in leadership at Boeing and a proper focus on quality and design, and finding its identity, will hopefully see an end to the main problems at the manufacturer and it can get back to building great aircraft, and genuinely rebuild trust amongst its employees and improve the quality and reputation of the brand.