does anyone know about SJAR??

[kirky 269]

I,ve just had my assessment read to me over the phone(i'm out of area) it seems ok but i dont know what any of it means can anyone explain the new system and promotion catagories?? i've got dev in mine some one said it meant developing forget me if im wrong i've worked ma t1ts off and it seems ive dropped down a few notches if anyone can explain id be grateful

 

[True Blue Jack]

Getting a debrief over the phone sounds a bit off but never mind.

The promotion recommendations on the SJAR are not intended to correlate directly with those on the F6000. "Spec Rec" on the old system does not automatically equate to "Exceptional" on the new, and "Developing" is supposed to be nothing like "Likely to become fit".

You will have the opportunity to read your appraisal fully before you complete your suicide box so you will have plenty of time to decide if the narrative is not what you hoped it would be. Did your 1RO explain why he didn't feel able to award you at least a "Yes" for promotion?

In the meantime, your OOA admin office should have JSP 752 on CD-ROM. Read the section on promotion recommendations and that may reassure you. But with any new system we will only know if it's working when it's been around for a couple of years. Not that that is much help to you or me right now but I get the impression that Stn Cdrs everywhere are stamping down hard on 'assessment creep' from the word go. Mine certainly is.

 

[busby1971]

Creep

Creep

TBJ, clamping down on assessment creep, due to the slow promotion in many trades of recent times assessments have risen as people have not been promoted, this is not creep but a fact of life.

Having been personally told that I couldn't have a spec as somebody had already had it on the unit (Army unit held it's own board RAF Admin WO would not stand up for his troops - told I would get a fully supported High but a unsupported Spec if I kicked up a stink) each individual should be honestly reported upon, if a CO is restricting assessments he is hindering his guys against those not on his unit and subject to the same restrictions.

It's a tough one but in an organisation as big as ours what could be better, there is no perfect system!

 

[PD TC]

TBJ, clamping down on assessment creep, due to the slow promotion in many trades of recent times assessments have risen as people have not been promoted, this is not creep but a fact of life.

Having been personally told that I couldn't have a spec as somebody had already had it on the unit (Army unit held it's own board RAF Admin WO would not stand up for his troops - told I would get a fully supported High but a unsupported Spec if I kicked up a stink) each individual should be honestly reported upon, if a CO is restricting assessments he is hindering his guys against those not on his unit and subject to the same restrictions.

It's a tough one but in an organisation as big as ours what could be better, there is no perfect system!

Busby, I genuinely feel for you mate; it is appalling when people put in the work for 364 days of the year, then on the 365th day, they get let down by inaccurate assessing. People should be assessed against their performance and potential, not against maintaining statistics at Unit level.

However, the above is another classic example of people concentrating too much on 'the numbers'. The number of specs that go to promotion boards that do not have the write up to support it is astonishing. Conversely, the number of people on a well written High that are picked above the specs never ceases to amaze me.

It is the write up that gets you promoted!!

 

[kirky 269]

sjar

sjar

He did mention to me about the physical fitness bit of it. i disgracefully failled my aft and currently rag my @rrse of in the gym trying to pass it. so even though every thing else is above satisfactory i dropped a few marks on this part of it and said he couldn't recomend me for promotion because of this failure in my reporting year. I am trying hard to pass the aft but instead of getting help i just get pelters from loads of gimps round the station P ed are the worst for it.

 

[True Blue Jack]

It is the write up that gets you promoted!!

Absolutely, and for at least the next couple of years I think the promotion recommendations will be largely ignored by boards - guesswork from me, but I think it's sound - until people get used to SJARs.

We'll soon see if people with well-written "Yes" recommendations get promoted. Either way, people will have to walk on water to get an "Exceptional". I recall Clive Loader, when he was a lowly Stn Cdr, giving a brief on the 'new' F6000. He said that he would prefer to see an appraisal system in which people were declared either fit for promotion or not. I think he is stamping his will on the way SJARs are being written.

 

[Humble Scribe]

He did mention to me about the physical fitness bit of it. i disgracefully failled my aft and currently rag my @rrse of in the gym trying to pass it. so even though every thing else is above satisfactory i dropped a few marks on this part of it and said he couldn't recomend me for promotion because of this failure in my reporting year. I am trying hard to pass the aft but instead of getting help i just get pelters from loads of gimps round the station P ed are the worst for it.

Personally, I'd rather see someone working their 'arris off in an effort to attain the fitness standard (which doesn't come easy to all at the new levels) and showing a good attitude to fitness rather than the guy who achieves the standard without much effort; at least it shows that you want to achieve the standard and are willing to work for it and it gives the RO something positive to write about.

As for Busby's senario, a well written HR has always (since F6442 was binned) been worth more than an averagely written SR; as long as it is well written!

 

[sorbs]

Dev does indeed stand for Developing which you could believe to be a positive recommendation. However, during my AMLC we had a presentation by the Prom Board fellows from Manning and they stated that in fact a Dev is seen by them as a Not Recommended.

 

[PD TC]

Dev does indeed stand for Developing which you could believe to be a positive recommendation. However, during my AMLC we had a presentation by the Prom Board fellows from Manning and they stated that in fact a Dev is seen by them as a Not Recommended.

And in a way, they are absolutely right. What becomes confusing is the number of recommendations we have that are above 'promote now', which effectively 'Yes' is saying.

If you take RAF Regt, they are a perfect example of how to correctly use the Prom recs. A guy may go for many years with a Dev (or old equivalent, (I'm sorry but there are some parallels with the F6000)) will then get a Rec and be promoted on it. Not because he has suddenly got a Rec but because the right up says that 'this guy is now ready for promotion, so here it is fella'.

The myriad of recommendations only complicate the matter by giving us:
'he is ready for promotion',
'he was really ready for promotion years ago' and
'what the hell is going on, promote the lad now you muppets before we lose him!!!'

However, most trades do not use this because RO's feel (rightly or wrongly) that they know when a person should be promoted and inflate the recommendation either in the belief that they are helping the Subject or to placate them. In reality, and beyond the short term, they are often wrong on both occasions. In their defence, much of this is down to poor promotion prospects. The key is better understating and training on the purpose and presentation of appraisals. This is Performance Management!!! … and we are woefully lacking in it by still treating it as something we do for 3 days a year when it is appraisal time. SH!T

 

[kirky 269]

so

so

so it goes back to the "i've basically dropped out the running for promotion" even though i've stayed out of trouble, built up a good trade knowledge, and i'm good at my job why do i bother working all those extra hours and actually doing a good job when it doesn't really count for sweet FA

 

[TDJ]

so it goes back to the "i've basically dropped out the running for promotion" even though i've stayed out of trouble, built up a good trade knowledge, and i'm good at my job why do i bother working all those extra hours and actually doing a good job when it doesn't really count for sweet FA

And of course you have failed your fitness test - it aint that hard to pass - a bit of phys for a weeks before works wonders. Its no wonder your Boss dropped the promotion recommendation - you only have yourself to blame for that one. This may sound a bit harsh, but I would rather have an individual who could pass his fit test and then really concentrate on his work, rather than someone who has to have time off during the working day to do his remedial training!

See if your A1 cell where you are OOA have access to remote JPA, you should be able to view it that way. Other than that ask your boss to cut and paste it into a word document and email it to you - have a read and then chat with your OOA Chf Clk or DAO if you are still concerned.

 

[Humble Scribe]

And of course you have failed your fitness test - it aint that hard to pass - a bit of phys for a weeks before works wonders. Its no wonder your Boss dropped the promotion recommendation - you only have yourself to blame for that one. This may sound a bit harsh, but I would rather have an individual who could pass his fit test and then really concentrate on his work, rather than someone who has to have time off during the working day to do his remedial training!

Don't agree TDJ. The fitness test may not be hard for you to pass but there are lads & lasses out there who for whatever reason either struggle to find the time or are not that way inclined to find the new test easy. Attitudes will have to change and in 2-3 years time I might agree with you but there has to be some slack where those who have found it difficult to train adjust their regimes to include some form of PT.

I can see where you're coming from regarding the guys having time off work to do their remedial training but a lot of these guys are the ones who have, in the past, stayed in work on a Wednesday afternoon to cover while the likes of you & I have played sport and kept fit; payback time now!!

As long as Kirky shows the right attitude and continues his rehabilitation in the PT world I don't have a problem with it or him. Of course there will be the lazy b@rstards who will never want to show any inclination to get fit and to them I have no sympathy when they're shown the door.

 

[TDJ]

Don't agree TDJ. The fitness test may not be hard for you to pass but there are lads & lasses out there who for whatever reason either struggle to find the time or are not that way inclined to find the new test easy. Attitudes will have to change and in 2-3 years time I might agree with you but there has to be some slack where those who have found it difficult to train adjust their regimes to include some form of PT.

I can see where you're coming from regarding the guys having time off work to do their remedial training but a lot of these guys are the ones who have, in the past, stayed in work on a Wednesday afternoon to cover while the likes of you & I have played sport and kept fit; payback time now!!

As long as Kirky shows the right attitude and continues his rehabilitation in the PT world I don't have a problem with it or him. Of course there will be the lazy b@rstards who will never want to show any inclination to get fit and to them I have no sympathy when they're shown the door.

Understand your point HS - but the fit test has been around for years. When SJAR was being briefed some 18 months ago a big thing was made out of the fitness element that would be included. I passed the test being 5 stone overweight, with knackered knees and not having done much phys for about a year. Yep it was hard work but a bit of mental toughness for 9 minutes saw me through it. Understand that some may have difficulty with the bleep test and personally I see no problem with a mil and half variant - however, with a shrinking and more competitive airforce you have to tick all the boxes to get promoted. Physical fitness is a personal issue. AMP did decree that time should be given during the working week to get some in (appreciate that this may not be feasible on all units) - but being able to find 40 minutes 3 times a week isnt that difficult surely.

However, agree with the attitude thing. Not all pass the first time round and provided he shows the right attitude, does his remedial work then he should be fine. Everyone gets a second chance I believe.

 

[True Blue Jack]

but being able to find 40 minutes 3 times a week isnt that difficult surely.

It's very difficult if you're not that way inclined, or if you spend 3 hours in the car getting to and from work each day or if you are genuinely that busy at work. I am lucky that my current job allows me to spend 1.5 hours in the gym most days; I am now able to play catch up for the almost 3 years when I was unable to escape my office.

I agree that people have had plenty of time to get used to the idea of the fitness test generally and of the new levels. Even so, many people failed to achieve a pass last year and many more will fail this year. They are not all lazy, nor mentally weak.

I dont mind admitting I hate doing the fitness test and would rather do CCS twice a year. At a recent RAFFT Co-ords meeting one of the reps stated he didn't understand why people had a problem with the fitness test and he would happily do it once a week if it meant he never again had to do CCS. Horses for courses, I guess.

 

[Trembling Scumbag]

Sjar annotations.....

Sjar annotations.....

So basically, If you get a yes on your SJAR for promotion to the next rank, that is the same as a rec was?? I got a rec, with 5's and a few 4's last year, and a 'yes' with an even mix of B plusses and A minuses this year, do these roughly equal each other???? or have I gone backwards????DT_Xtremez_40:

 

[Little Tronk]

So basically, If you get a yes on your SJAR for promotion to the next rank, that is the same as a rec was?? I got a rec, with 5's and a few 4's last year, and a 'yes' with an even mix of B plusses and A minuses this year, do these roughly equal each other???? or have I gone backwards????DT_Xtremez_40:

Bloody Hell!! He's the second coming if our briefs are anything to go by!!!

 

[spanners]

Bloody Hell!! He's the second coming if our briefs are anything to go by!!!

I was thinking that too! With those grades, should have been a spec, with immediate promotion!DT_Xtremez_35:

 

[TDJ]

So basically, If you get a yes on your SJAR for promotion to the next rank, that is the same as a rec was?? I got a rec, with 5's and a few 4's last year, and a 'yes' with an even mix of B plusses and A minuses this year, do these roughly equal each other???? or have I gone backwards????DT_Xtremez_40:

It is difficult to draw a comparison - but from what you say a good mix of b+'s and a-'s is solid (remember a standard B grade means you are doing everything to the standard expected ie you are doing your job well) - a yes for promotion is also positive - the key though is your potential for 2 ranks - this is the element that promotion boards will focus on when looking at scores on the doors - then they will view the write up and make a judgement from there.

Also what was your OPG (the final grade - but bear in mind this should not be an average of the other scores)

 

[Trembling Scumbag]

Opg??

Opg??

Not too sure about the OPG thing, ive only seen the 1st RO, Im currently OOA and need to speak to the author about a few spelling and grammar issues before i sign as agreeing to it. There are the 2 boxes with promotion to next rank- yes, and promotion to 2 ranks above- Dev. I assume that means that ive been assessed as being ready for promotion (by the 1st RO) but still developing the potential to go 2 ranks up????

 

[Stax]

Recently did 25 2nd RO's and 3 1st RO's for SAC's and am currently doing 5 1st RO's for SNCO's. I find the SJAR a lot better, mainly because there is no room for bull5hit! You have to say exactly what you need to in the limited space you have. On the potential box, heres a tip, ask the advice of a Sqn Ldr on this box, they are used to doing JO's on OJAR's and know what the best way is. You don't have to fill the potential box, you need to say why this candidate would be a fantastic JNCO, Instructor etc so choose your words carefully. On the subject of "Developing" for many of the SAC's this is probably the best you can give an him or her for two ranks up, even if you genuinely believe they would make a fantastic JNCO. Any OOA should have some kind of access to JPA to allow you to read and comment on your SJAR, it doesn't go to the 2nd RO until you are happy (or the 1st RO is adamant in his comments).