GYH(M) Strikes Again!

[Mr_Mover]

Hello all,

Some of you may remember that this time last year, I was backdated for GYH(M) which I was eligible for until a specific T Letter came out. Well, this issue has once again reared its ugly head and it looks like I'm going to be raped for it...again!

Last year, I was posted to a minor Army unit and was asked about my living arrangements by my Unit Admin Office. I was asked to produce my council tax bill as per their Unit Admin procedures and my GYH(M) was set up. This was after I had explained that the rules had changed and that I believed I was no longer eligible. I was told that until they were informed otherwise (from their powers that be I believe), I would continue to receive the allowance. Fast forward 12 months and Unit orders now stipulate that everyone has to provide four pieces of evidence about whether they own or rent their properties. Now, it looks like I may have to write to SPVA to explain my circumstances (my girlfriend owns the house but I pay my share of the mortgage/bills etc and its kept in a logbook). The bombshell is that if I'm found to be ineligible, its likely that my allowance will be backdated and I will face a debt of at least £2500 which will cripple me and will mean that I can no longer afford to go home on my time off.

Will this matter be seen as my fault seeing as my Adminers were not aware of my apparent ineligibility even after I'd advised them of it? If I'm backdated, could I somehow point out that I did all I could as far as ensuring my pay statement was correct? Any advice would be much appreciated, I just don't understand why I should be penalised because my Adminers were not up to date with the rule changes to GYH(M). The irony behind this is that its the complete opposite of what happened to me at my previous camp!

Many Thanks
S.

 

[timaloy]

you could argue the case as it was the aminers fault, but i'd be prepared to start paying it back. I can't see them saying its ok we'll just write that debt off, Still they can only take 4 days pay per month so it won't be a lump sum

 

[Joe_90]

Not to try and kick you when your down but I think the 4 day thing is for a debt such as new carpets and decorating if you destroyed your room. I think an allowance overpayment can be taken in one go, it happened to a colleague who was audited for a large amount while on terminal leave and had no access to JPA so didn't know about it and had almost a full months pay taken off him. It took a while to get it back as well.

 

[riffraff]

MM

When were you posted? The rules changed on 01 Apr 09. If you were already in receipt of GYH(T) and it was duly authorised with a copy of a council tax bill then I would be asking the question why do you have to provide the extra evidence now.

The regulations are quite clear that:

"The documents are to be provided on initial claim and where there is a change in personal circumstances which may affect entitlement."

Hope this helps and you get it all sorted.

 

[The Masked Geek]

I'd say you've screwed yourself.

Accepting an allowance that you weren't entitled to and not banking it for when they claimed it back, is mental.

 

[riffraff]

Not to try and kick you when your down but I think the 4 day thing is for a debt such as new carpets and decorating if you destroyed your room. I think an allowance overpayment can be taken in one go, it happened to a colleague who was audited for a large amount while on terminal leave and had no access to JPA so didn't know about it and had almost a full months pay taken off him. It took a while to get it back as well.

Joe,

Allowances claimed for through JPA expenses can be reclaimed in full, however GYH(T) is paid monthly through your pay account so is subject to the 4 days gross pay rules.

 

[Mr_Mover]

MM

When were you posted? The rules changed on 01 Apr 09. If you were already in receipt of GYH(T) and it was duly authorised with a copy of a council tax bill then I would be asking the question why do you have to provide the extra evidence now.

The regulations are quite clear that:

"The documents are to be provided on initial claim and where there is a change in personal circumstances which may affect entitlement."

Hope this helps and you get it all sorted.

This is the precise phrase I was quoted when I had a similar problem last year, however, it didn't hold much water with my Admin SNCO at the time. I was posted at the end of November 08, but I was made aware of T Letter 321 in Oct 08 which also had a wef 31 Jul 08.

 

[Mr_Mover]

I'd say you've screwed yourself.

Accepting an allowance that you weren't entitled to and not banking it for when they claimed it back, is mental.

JSP 752 says I was entitled to it, T Letter 321 says I'm not, and my Adminers tell me I am. What was I supposed to do? I told them more than once that I was not entitled to it. I can do my job properly, why shouldn't I expect the same from people in other trades?

 

[The Masked Geek]

I can do my job properly, why shouldn't I expect the same from people in other trades?

Don't get me wrong, I do sympathise with your situation but "sod's law" should always be respected.

 

[Mightierthan]

The eligibilty, in your case, didn't change on 1 Apr. The bad news is that you are not, and never have been eligible. Believe me, I have staffed similar cases. The long and short is that, you can receive HTD to travel back to a home you own in your own right, or a family home. You do not own the home in question in your own right and, as the person who does own the home is not your wife nor your same-sex partner recognised by a civil partnership, the home cannot be classed as a family home.

If the money is recovered, it will be at 4 days gross pay per month (unless you either request this is increased, or submit a case for it to be decreased).

You can apply to have the debt waived, claiming what is known as estopell. This basically means that you received the money in good faith and have spent it on what it was given for. You will have to demonstrate, by producing receipts/proof of travel that you have spent the money. I suspect that this will be very difficult. I have only seen one good case to have a debt waived on these grounds, and it was not successful.

Not good news I know, but hopefully you are a bit more in the picture.

 

[Mr_Mover]

The eligibilty, in your case, didn't change on 1 Apr. The bad news is that you are not, and never have been eligible. Believe me, I have staffed similar cases. The long and short is that, you can receive HTD to travel back to a home you own in your own right, or a family home. You do not own the home in question in your own right and, as the person who does own the home is not your wife nor your same-sex partner recognised by a civil partnership, the home cannot be classed as a family home.

If the money is recovered, it will be at 4 days gross pay per month (unless you either request this is increased, or submit a case for it to be decreased).

You can apply to have the debt waived, claiming what is known as estopell. This basically means that you received the money in good faith and have spent it on what it was given for. You will have to demonstrate, by producing receipts/proof of travel that you have spent the money. I suspect that this will be very difficult. I have only seen one good case to have a debt waived on these grounds, and it was not successful.

Not good news I know, but hopefully you are a bit more in the picture.

Thank you very much for this clarification, this is what I've been asking for since I first received the allowance but no one has made the effort to make my position particularly clear. With your explanation, I can now see why I am not eligible. I'm happy to prove whatever I need to because I keep all receipts, however, in this case, I will go with what has been said and will let the issue lie. It was nice whilst it lasted but now I'll just have to swallow the cost myself. Thanks again for all the helpful replies and as someone has already mentioned, "sod's law" should always be respected!

Thanks
S.