Jointery is for Carpenters

[T55]

Do any of you guys out there have to work for the Army on an allegedly "Joint" sqn? Do you find them incredibly inflexible and blinkered in that the only way is the Army way?

 

[reddeathdrinker]

Do any of you guys out there have to work for the Army on an allegedly "Joint" sqn? Do you find them incredibly inflexible and blinkered in that the only way is the Army way?

Anyone at Basrah International would agree with you there......

 

[Goaty]

Afghanistan.....

Afghanistan.....

In the interests of "Jointery" or however you spell it, the Army tried to make the Armourers on 1310 at Kandahar do it their way (which is by all accounts the JHC way). The DARMO and Strike however feel that the 1310 way is the right way and this seems to **** the AAC off no end.........................So there...............................

 

[Get Tae]

Anyone at Basrah International would agree with you there......

Weel said that man. I love the way the army look down on the RAF, the quote I heard to a RAF Cpl " ****ing hell mate you must be ****e if you are still a Cpl after the years you've been in". They do not realise how long it takes most folks to get through the ranks. The worst thing I saw at Basrah was a jumped up RSM coming round inspecting our tent who was freekin younger than I was adn I was a snec. They also like to shout a lot I have noticed, shout shout shout is all they can do.
Jointery shmointery.

 

[Rebel without A Clue]

When I was at Shaibah Logs Base a couple of years ago, we had PT every Monday morning. The RSM would have us all stood at attention before every session and b0ll0ck US because he wasn't happy with the lack of people attending! To top it all off, he had someone paint 6 disabled car parking spaces and threatened to charge anyone who parked in them!!! They live in a world of their own.

 

[Silverback]

Just back from a course at the Defence School of Transport, where Jointery means teaching at the lowest level of understanding, i.e., a Private in the Royal Logistics Corps. The instructors were continually apologising to the RAF types for the speed and content of course delivery and the Army 'tradesmen' and their lack of interest or ability.

If we have to have Jointery, and unfortunately we do, then lets buy in wholesale and re-rank as WOII, Staff Sgt, L/Cpl etc and align it all.

Comments!?!?!

 

[Notsoblunt]

I've been in the 'Joint' world for the past 5 years now, firstly with a matelot boss and more recently with a pongo one. As senior officers (both Gp Capt equivalents) they have both tried to instigate the procedures of their own mother service in one way or another, but without much success.

On more than one occasion I have been heard to remark "If I wanted to join your lot I would have gone to your Careers Office in the first place. I wear light blue, not dark (or green). When we all start wearing purple, as anything 'Joint Service' is supposed to be, then I'll do things your way. In the meantime, it says 'RAF' on my pay packet and that's the way I like it."

Perhaps I have only managed to get away with it because I am the only RAF bloke in the place, and they don't know how to deal with someone who can think for themselves and isn't going to jump up and follow their every whim at the drop of a hat!

 

[fitbin]

I currently work within the 'joint' world and yes, the are very blinkered.
Funny when the RSM screams at his blokes to do something, we sit sniggering, then he comes over and quietly says something like "er, excuse me gents, if you're not too busy, would you mind helping my lads do blah?".
Their poor faces, makes us wonder why they put up with being spoken to like that.
No brains, I tell thee...DT_Xtremez_28:

 

[vim_fuego]

I have to 'interact' in my world of jointery with the whole spectrum and these are a few of my observations...

The navy are ok although they don't party as hard as I'd heard...the underwater types seem better than the skimmers, marines are ok once they've gone up a few ranks, most of the guys with black tape on their eyes know how to 'tie one on' and join in.

Army...standard machine gun charging types are a bit 'chew each mouthful 17 times', AAC commisioned types talk down to the non-comms a bit too much considering they all just piloted and landed in the same type of complicated transport...I've noticed that generally, across the board, they never know how to truly switch off...I play cricket with a few and there are senior RAF bods playing and its call me bob (or whatever)...the Army types, even when playing civvies, are , 'Good shot General...'DT_Xtremez_03: Their black tape on their eyes types tend to keep themselves to themselves until they are really p*ssed then come over and attempt comms but just end up spitting in your ear...

As an aside...I once took two army tank drivers offshore sailing...they were about 18-19...I nearly pulled my hair out trying to make them have a thought of their own...It was labour intensive because I did'nt like to leave them unattended for too long...if they'd have fallen overboard I would have to have been there to order them to swim...:raf:

 

[T55]

Ranks

Ranks

Just back from a course at the Defence School of Transport, where Jointery means teaching at the lowest level of understanding, i.e., a Private in the Royal Logistics Corps. The instructors were continually apologising to the RAF types for the speed and content of course delivery and the Army 'tradesmen' and their lack of interest or ability.

If we have to have Jointery, and unfortunately we do, then lets buy in wholesale and re-rank as WOII, Staff Sgt, L/Cpl etc and align it all.

Comments!?!?!

Yes I agree, ranks should have equivalency accross all services. I understand that the Royal Navy (any service with "Royal" in their name are good) took up the WO2 option but the RAF didn't want it. It means more pay and pensions for Flight Sergeants effectively and whilst most of them have been conned into the service to age 55 and comfy pension scenario then why pay them more? I suppose that the Army would argue that unlike the other services they cannot stay beyond 22 years unless commissioned, however, I believe this is on fitness grounds. Personnally I think that the ability to do a bit of running whilst shooting wooden targets does not make me a better or worse techie and I don't ever envisage having to shoot in anger, we do have RAF Reg after all for those dodgy moments!

 

[Scooby]

Do any of you guys out there have to work for the Army on an allegedly "Joint" sqn? Do you find them incredibly inflexible and blinkered in that the only way is the Army way?

Has anyone been to Camp Akrotiri? or that's what the Army would like to think..I am sure it still says RAF on the main gate......and as for TSU/CSSU etc.....it like banging you head off a brick wall!! Only that would be fun!!DT_Xtremez_34:

 

[Get Tae]

I understand that the Royal Navy (any service with "Royal" in their name are good) took up the WO2 option but the RAF didn't want it. It means more pay and pensions for Flight Sergeants

Whilst in the sandy place a few weeks ago I was speaking to a WO1 RE guy and he stated in no uncertain terms that a FS was not equivalent to a WO2 and dam all those in the RAF who think it is!!
He said 'show me a Flt Sgt RAF type who hold the queens warrant and I will eat my own sh1te!' so they see chf tech/flt sgt as the same as staff sgts, comments...

 

[Hu Jardon]

He said 'show me a Flt Sgt RAF type who hold the queens warrant and I will eat my own sh1te!' so they see chf tech/flt sgt as the same as staff sgts, comments...

That'll be a MACR then cos their badge looks like a WOII one doesn't it

 

[T55]

Ranks

Ranks

Whilst in the sandy place a few weeks ago I was speaking to a WO1 RE guy and he stated in no uncertain terms that a FS was not equivalent to a WO2 and dam all those in the RAF who think it is!!
He said 'show me a Flt Sgt RAF type who hold the queens warrant and I will eat my own sh1te!' so they see chf tech/flt sgt as the same as staff sgts, comments...

My experience of Staff Sgts is that they have less managerial ability than most RAF Cpls. Personally I believe the slippery slope started when the Chf Tech rank was devalued to below FS. I could go on about techies having to through 2 more ranks than everyone else and not having so much opportunity for a full career but I think that's a thread in progress elsewhere. I do feel that the RAF have let us down in not adopting the WO2 rank, if the military think jointery is the way ahead then we must have equivalent ranks. I'm sure it's all about saving money and screwing techies!

 

[Get Tae]

My experience of Staff Sgts is that they have less managerial ability than most RAF Cpls. Personally I believe the slippery slope started when the Chf Tech rank was devalued to below FS. I could go on about techies having to through 2 more ranks than everyone else and not having so much opportunity for a full career but I think that's a thread in progress elsewhere. I do feel that the RAF have let us down in not adopting the WO2 rank, if the military think jointery is the way ahead then we must have equivalent ranks. I'm sure it's all about saving money and screwing techies!

Lets hope they do adopt it then, that means Cpl after ten mins, Sgt after 35 mins etc etc...........
Bring it on in no time we will all be Martial of the RAF with appropriate ret. on full pay......HOORAY!!

 

[FOMz]

Ahhhhhh Jointry - what aload of Sh1te that is. The JHC lot out at KAF, I have to say are so anal its unbeleivable. In their own tiny minds they are the most important people who work in the K-Span and try to impose their pathetic rules and regs on everyone else.

The whole place is expected to be silnt during their 3 daily briefings and anyone who even farts loadly is Shusshed!!!! When anyone else is briefing its an entirely different matter, why should they be quiet, they're doing operational type stuff..........

Bunch of ******

 

[Algernon Tweedy]

Jointery

Jointery

Worked with our green colleagues for over three years and took great pleasure in going against everything they stood for particularly their fitness regime. Every Tuesday and Thursday attended the Sgt Majors "parade" just to say yes to my name and then took great pleasure in them all departing on an 8 miler whilst I went to the gym to do the RAF's brand of fitness god it wrankled them. Friday morning it was "battlefield" pt....running around the airfield wheeling a JCB wheel or pushing a 3/4 tone trailer again I refused to partake (not because I couldn't do it) but because there was nothing they could do to me when I said no. They threatened to make me work late Friday afternoon if I didn't comply....I loved fridays ....managed to catch up with all my admin as the rest of the unit stood down.

Jointery u can keep it.

Cheers for now

Algy

 

[stereolab]

Jointery - a new future

Jointery - a new future

Having left the RAF 10 years ago, not much experience of jointery, but plenty of experience seeing our SACs and Cpls running sections full of Army types 2 and 3 ranks higher, and in particular lazy NATO bods, who did not know the meaning of having a work ethos, turning up for work when it suited them, yet being promoted in situ, I fear that full jointery is a long long way in the future and believe that RAF personnel will again get the short end of the stick.

 

[ROTORHEAD]

Pond life.

Pond life.

Pre todays attempts at jointery, I've been well wound up standing in Army messes trying to get a drink only to have to wait for the RSM to allow the bar open. (Apparently a lot of them get a share of the gaming machine profits as a perk of being the head man!)

Also fell foul of an obnoxious little scrote of a 'Gisum', G.S.M, Garrison Sergeant Major in Belize. Despite Airport Camp being RAF Belize there were pongoes in charge, I ask you?

Also RAF Chessington, the erk's old rehabilitation unit, Army run again.

Despite the view from the moral high ground being very nice, and the knowledge that RAF people have brains and the ability to use them, It really does grip my 5hit how poorly we fare when plonked in the Bundoo with our Green or Dark blue brethren.

 

[novembercharlie]

Weel said that man. I love the way the army look down on the RAF, the quote I heard to a RAF Cpl " ****ing hell mate you must be ****e if you are still a Cpl after the years you've been in". They do not realise how long it takes most folks to get through the ranks. The worst thing I saw at Basrah was a jumped up RSM coming round inspecting our tent who was freekin younger than I was adn I was a snec. They also like to shout a lot I have noticed, shout shout shout is all they can do.
Jointery shmointery.

As the Duke of Wellington said, SHOUT, SHOUT AND SHOUT AGAIN!!!
_________________________________________________________________

You were in the RAF!! So you have no military experience at all then really?????