SJAR/OJAR What do we think?

[Shiney Pencil]

Was at Innsworth the other day for the SJAR brief, some very good stuff coming out of there, its nice to see what other units are doing. Any hints/tips/whats working for you at your unit?

 

[KingGuin]

Had mine the other day and very pleased I was with it too. However I found it quite unsettling to look at the gradings e.g. B+ and find a one line definition when I am used to a matrix guide with the F6000. However I like the concept and can only hope and pray it may, at last, lead to the end of assessment creep. However, cynical as ever, I am not holding my breath.

 

[True Blue Jack]

I think we're a step ahead of most units because all our sqn ldrs had to have a JPA OJAR when our boss changed over the other week. It is a really good system, albeit it has a few bugs (don't try printing an appraisal!), and is far easier to manage than the current OJAR/F6000.

The report you can run so you can see exactly where all your ongoing appraisals are is superb. SNCOs are going to struggle for a little while differentiating between performance and potential but it is a far simpler change to get used to than when we moved from Fs6442 to Fs6000.

Bottom line: I like it. DT_Xtremez_19:

 

[Woodja]

Was also at the briefing on Tuesday - so far I like the SJAR/JPA OJAR - great improvement on the current 6000/OJAR with regards to trackability (slightly biased as a large part of mine and the SACs job is chasing senoir officers in town for outstanding reports - no excuses now)

A few other things that came out of the breif may have an impact - the fact that ACOS(Manning) will no longer be chasing overdue reports until just before a board is due to sit, and the proposal (and it is just a proposal at this time) that the routine sitting of a Missed Appraisal Board be stopped, with it only sitting after the Station/Unit Commander of the subject writing with justifications to the Manning Gp Capt (with the slim possibility that the boards get scrapped altogether - so that if an individual does not ensure that his/her report gets to the board on time, they will not be looked at that year).

As I said, those last two ideas are just suggestions, they may never happen, but it squarely puts the responsibility for the reports getting completed before the boards are due to sit on the shoulders of the subject.

Oh, back on subject, I like the SJAR system, will make my job much easier (once we have all the Roles&Responsibilities sorted) - they just need to iron out the bugs (just like the rest of JPA) and it will be a great system.

 

[metimmee]

Looks good, but 1st ROs will have to be careful to complete the 'potential' block correctly. Interesting that subject comments (or whatever its called) is 32K characters long, but the performance block is only 1850 chars. I can see 1st ROs coaching subjects to expand on multiple B+ and above if he runs out of room.

 

[Shiney Pencil]

Had to go and see a 1* this morning as he did not have a clue what he was doing. All he could say was that the system was rubbish. Very much agree with the hastening side, the individual should be more responsible and if I get my way we will hasten the first year the SJAR is out then after that over to you.

Personally I think that it is a massive step forward but as with all things JPA it needs some time to bed in, sure that in the near future all will be rosey!!!!

 

[FOMz]

Not being a scribbly or having ben to one of these briefs yet. What happens if your SJAR is due and you are OOA? do you miss the board that year? Is it going to be a case of you should have been on the board, but because you were OOA and your SJAR was not submitted in time - you've sh1t out, better luck next time (well if you're not OOA again)

Sort of favours the desert dodgers if thats the case.

 

[True Blue Jack]

Had to go and see a 1* this morning as he did not have a clue what he was doing. All he could say was that the system was rubbish. Very much agree with the hastening side, the individual should be more responsible and if I get my way we will hasten the first year the SJAR is out then after that over to you.

Personally I think that it is a massive step forward but as with all things JPA it needs some time to bed in, sure that in the near future all will be rosey!!!!

That is very much what I believe the plan to be. Essentially it is YOUR career so it is in your interests to make sure your appraisal is completed on time. Even if SAC Bloggs doesn't want to get promoted there is an effect on his annual increment if his appraisal is not done. Give it 2 full cycles, i.e., until Nov 09, and Unit HR will not even be responsible for raising the HR and setting up the reporting chains - it will all be down to the individual. Unfortunately it will be another nail in the TG17 coffin when that happens.

Not being a scribbly or having ben to one of these briefs yet. What happens if your SJAR is due and you are OOA? do you miss the board that year? Is it going to be a case of you should have been on the board, but because you were OOA and your SJAR was not submitted in time - you've sh1t out, better luck next time (well if you're not OOA again)

Sort of favours the desert dodgers if thats the case.

The question will be answered fully when you go to a brief, but in simple terms, because it is JPA-based it doesn't matter where in the world you are. Even if you have no access to JPA at all there is a non-standard appraisal report (NSAR) which is basically a Word template. Complete the NSAR and return it to your normal Unit HR who will get JPAC to transcribe it into the appraisal proper. Also, the appraisal is raised at the start of the reporting period and is a living document right up until the day Unit HR 'finalise' it, so (agian in theory) even if you get dicked for OOA at very short notice, completing your appraisal should be quick work.

 

[FOMz]

Cheers for that, but what if you are OOA for the entire period the report is meant to be being produced? I can just see it now..

Basrah under mortor attack............

SAC Bloggs my man, you haven't done your SJAR, its going to be late you know.....

Sir......................Fcuk off at this precise moment of time.

 

[Boarderlyne]

Cheers for that, but what if you are OOA for the entire period the report is meant to be being produced? I can just see it now..

Basrah under mortor attack............

SAC Bloggs my man, you haven't done your SJAR, its going to be late you know.....

Sir......................Fcuk off at this precise moment of time.

Fomz, you are a cynical sod! DT_Xtremez_28: As TBJ stated, the report goes on throughout the year so this situation should not arise. But it will come down to the 1st RO's to keep an eye on their troops to make sure that the reports are kept moving.

 

[tommo9999]

I'm a big fan of SJAR/OJAR and JPA in general. Yes, we are still discovering how to use it properly, yes the training was poor, yes it was rolled out too early, but it's a great system. It may spell the end of TG17 eventually, but that's progress.

 

[busbyboy]

That is very much what I believe the plan to be. Essentially it is YOUR career so it is in your interests to make sure your appraisal is completed on time. Even if SAC Bloggs doesn't want to get promoted there is an effect on his annual increment if his appraisal is not done. Give it 2 full cycles, i.e., until Nov 09, and Unit HR will not even be responsible for raising the HR and setting up the reporting chains - it will all be down to the individual. Unfortunately it will be another nail in the TG17 coffin when that happens.




The question will be answered fully when you go to a brief, but in simple terms, because it is JPA-based it doesn't matter where in the world you are. Even if you have no access to JPA at all there is a non-standard appraisal report (NSAR) which is basically a Word template. Complete the NSAR and return it to your normal Unit HR who will get JPAC to transcribe it into the appraisal proper. Also, the appraisal is raised at the start of the reporting period and is a living document right up until the day Unit HR 'finalise' it, so (agian in theory) even if you get dicked for OOA at very short notice, completing your appraisal should be quick work.

Agree entirely that it is in the subject's own interest to ensure that the report is completed and progressed on time. The system should provide an audit trail, so if any of the doomsday scenarios should actually come to pass, the guilty party will be banged to rights and won't have a leg to stand on legally.
One further point, in the original concept there was scope to ensure that the
2nd/3rd RO (or whoever is last in the chain) could "finalise". I see no reason for it to be a Unit HR task. After all, isn't that why we lost Man Servs posts under JPA etc. Let responsibility lie where it should - with the chain of command and line managers. In any case, the tracking system on JPA should ensure visibility at all levels and, in an ideal world (if only), would avoid such situations arising.

 

[Woodja]

Agree entirely that it is in the subject's own interest to ensure that the report is completed and progressed on time. The system should provide an audit trail, so if any of the doomsday scenarios should actually come to pass, the guilty party will be banged to rights and won't have a leg to stand on legally.
One further point, in the original concept there was scope to ensure that the
2nd/3rd RO (or whoever is last in the chain) could "finalise". I see no reason for it to be a Unit HR task. After all, isn't that why we lost Man Servs posts under JPA etc. Let responsibility lie where it should - with the chain of command and line managers. In any case, the tracking system on JPA should ensure visibility at all levels and, in an ideal world (if only), would avoid such situations arising.

I could be wrong, but I think that Manning are losing the staff that checked CRs on arrival to weed out the errors that still exist - passing that work back to the Man Servs staffs at units (just like hastening).

And going by the amount of folks at the meeting last week, there are still a lot of Man Servs type posts out there.

So the Unit HR/Man Servs 'Finalise' is the final sanity check that everything is correct on a report - if the ROs can't get it right with 6000s and OJARs, what makes you think they would get it right with the JPA version without the odd hiccup (remembering that the next reality check would be the pre-board).

 

[Soon To Leave]

What about civvy line managers?

 

[tommo9999]

Get a stub account created on JPA, then crack on. Spk to your UEA in the first instance.

 

[FairyNuff]

Hello All,

Just doing mid terms on my sgts and thought I'd do them in an SJAR stylee.......
no training as yet but it looks fairly straight forward.

My only concern is making sure when the real appraisal comes round I don't end up scr*wing their careers up..... on F6000 we had 6 as outsatding etc etc...... with 3 being satis in all respects which seems to equate to B. So what's everyones opinion.... are we going A = 6, A- = 5, B+ = 4, B=3 and so on?

 

[The Stig A.D.I.]

I went to a Unit brief on SJARs for seniors the other day & we were advised to try not to relate the OJAR scores to those of the F.6000.

That said, it was a good brief and the help guide is pretty useful too, as are the references to related JSPs.

I'll be ok when I've got a few under my belt... Hopefully... Probably... I think...

DT_Xtremez_28:

 

[Roobsta]

I feel sorry for the guys who are bordering on promotion. The difference between them getting screwed over or promoted (taking the last 3-5 years F6000 into account) is even more down to the writing skills of the 1st RO. As we can't/shouldn't relate the letters to the F6000 numbers you COULD seriously damage their prospects. It happened the last time the system was changed and it'll happen this time. It will introduce assessment creep from the outset as many other SNCO at my place of work feel the way I do and don't want to have this on their hands as well.

In one comment it was stated that it was up to the individual to ensure their reports were complete and in another it stated it was up to line managers to ensure the subjects kept their reports moving. Which is correct - or is it both?

 

[Boarderlyne]

In truth, it's both. It's the subject's responsibility as in he wants to have a career and needs to make sure that his report goes in on time and makes him looks good or not as complete a tw*t as he actually is. It is the Line Managers' (both 1 & 2 RO) responsibility to keep the report moving along as they have their personal reports to worry about and this is another way that their time-management could be assessed.

Overall, since my last comment on this thread, I have had more experience with SJAR/OJAR and I can only find one reason to fault it and that is an admin function rather than a personnel issue. As long as the reports are raised at the start of the reporting period, it saves a mahoosive amount of time in chasing OOA reports (Sorry, I really mean NSAR) and also from phoning round sections to find out which RO is holding up a report. The only dramas I have had have been sorted out by the JPA gurus at Innsworth and I have yet to stump them with any question. IM & LT take a bow as you have both been outstanding and saved me from getting major grief from a Pongo 1* on many an occasion!

The only niggle that I have is do we really have to input the reporting chain every year? Is there no way of doing an automatic pick-up from the previous report and then changing only if necessary?