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V-force info needed

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Ex-Bay

SNAFU master
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Our local Spacies had an exercise the other night which included several time & distance calculations. I mention to the Instructor taking the class that it reminded me of Operation Black Buck.

So I've been asked to do a presentation. I've read 'Vulcan 607' and looked up all manner of griff on Wiki but I find myself lacking some basic facts; (to make it worse, I know not a lot about Power point either, other than it is difficult to get right without boring the hell out of the viewer).

1. How much fuel could a fully-bombed up Vulcan B2 take on?
2. Does the range data include this "fully-bombed up" configuration ?

3. How much fuel can a Victor Tanker take on ?
On the assumption that it needs to deliver a sufficiency to the receiving aircraft, how much can it deliver and what range to get it home ?

4. What's the range of the Victor Tanker ?
5. What is the rate of flow of fuel ?

So if there is a V-force expert out there who can seriously help me, I'd be very pleased; so would my local Spacies. By e-mail at need; a PM will start it off.
 
I'm sure someone will be along in a bit who can answer your specific questions but I can tell you that the total fuel used by XM607 and the supporting Victors was 1.5M lbs; assuming a typical density value that works out as around 87000 gallons (I've had a little bit of involvement with the making of a documentary which will be on Channel 4 next year).

But will your presentation be about Black Buck generally or will it be about the mathematical problems associated with the Black Buck refuelling plan? I think it may be difficult to make the latter presentation interesting to a group of air cadets no matter how good you are at Powerpoint.
 
Ex-Bay said:
(to make it worse, I know not a lot about Power point either, other than it is difficult to get right without boring the hell out of the viewer).
Click to expand...

I don't know a vulcan form the hole in me arse, but I know about ppt, and the secret is pulling them in. For every key fact, offer a multiple choice answer in turn, then ask em', then reveal the answer in the final revelation. They won't be able to wait for the next one.....usual story, make one outrageous (and funny) and one close.
 
PSBM: Yes, I think there probably is a moral. Serves me right for expressing an interest. . .

TBJ: The maths in the Black Buck job were Very Very similar to a couple of the problems set the cadets, involving several S = D/T problems all running together. That's why it reminded me.

Stevienic: Thanks for the hint. So far I have imported a couple of maps and a few pictures.
The questions will come afterwards !
 
With PPT don't put to much on the screen leave something for you the presenter to actually talk about. Nothing worse than a bloke just reading off the slide the very same info the audience can see. Short and concise on screen expand as required verbally. Remember KISS
 
In AP3003 theres a copy of the Black Buck Refuelling Plan, you can buy a copy on Ebay, or I'm sure you have a spacey who has a copy; the MOD gave enough of them away!
 
If memory serves, it isn't a straight forward calculation as some of the tankers had to be refuelled themselves to get on station and return to ascension. There were tankers to refuel the tankers.
 
Hence the Black Buck refuelling plan, which is a pictorial representation of the sequence :PDT_Xtremez_28:
 
MontyPlumbs said:
Hence the Black Buck refuelling plan, which is a pictorial representation of the sequence :PDT_Xtremez_28:
Click to expand...

Sorry Monty, the MOD didn't see fit to send me a copy! :PDT_Xtremez_31:

Thanks FOMz, was just looking at that on wiki.
 
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True Blue Jack said:
I'm sure someone will be along in a bit who can answer your specific questions but I can tell you that the total Ink used by XM607 and the supporting Victors was 1.5M lbs; assuming a typical density value that works out as around 1200 1771's (I've had a little bit of involvement with the making of a documentary which will be on Channel 4 next year).

But will your presentation be about Black Buck generally or will it be about the mathematical problems associated with the Black Buck refuelling plan? I think it may be difficult to make the latter presentation interesting to a group of air cadets no matter how good you are at Powerpoint.
Click to expand...

Sorry TBJ you'd confused your fluids there. :PDT_Xtremez_30:
 
This gives the fuel capicities for the Vulcan B2 circa 1980.Vulcan.jpg

also have the Crew manual for the Victor but it is the Blue streak version.
 
John Lloyd said:
That must have been a bluddy big Victor:PDT_Xtremez_28:
Click to expand...

ILLCK and myself saw that one being built at HSD plant in Stevenage when we were nippers!

Does anybody really know what the fuel usage by the Vulcan really was, as the aircraft's overweight condition for the first half of the mission, plus the drag from the two pylons and the Dash 10 ECM pod and its cruise at an un-economic attitude to stay in formation with the Victors were most likely never recorded in any Vulcan manual.
 
Not just the fuel, those burners must've got through a hell of a lot of lube on that run.
 
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