Welcome to E-Goat :: The Totally Unofficial Royal Air Force Rumour Network
Join our free community to unlock a range of benefits like:
  • Post and participate in discussions.
  • Send and receive private messages with other members.
  • Respond to polls and surveys.
  • Upload and share content.
  • Gain access to exclusive features and tools.
Join 7.5K others today

acting rank

  • Thread starter Thread starter The Dark Side
  • Start date Start date
  • Following weeks of work, the E-GOAT team are delighted to present to you a new look to the forums with plenty of new features. Take a look around and see what you think!
Trending This Week
View More Trending
T

The Dark Side

Guest
Can anyone give me the official gen on a query on acting rank.

a colleague has been informed by his boss (F/L) that he wants him to fill in for a Sgt, who is out soon. The Wing Co agrees to pay substitution pay but doesn't agree with acting rank. Is there policy on this?

Cheers in advance
 
I dont think he would get extra pay unless he holds that rank and he has to hold that next rankfor 28 days before substitution pay happens. At the very least it would be acting rank unpaid!? Why would the RAF pay someone without giving them added responsability!!!

see STC/37141/2/PS4 dated 16 Oct 00 for info
iaw...AP 3392 Vol 2 Leaflet 0565 Pt 4.

Hope that helps.
 
Rules for SUPA are in JSP 754 Chapter 3 Section 8. Para 03.0807 of that section should be noted in this case
Rules for Acting Rank are in JSP 754 Chapter 3 Section 9.

Happy intranet surfing(e-goat rules prevent us from qouting from intranet documents not available on the internet)
 
Climebear said:
Happy intranet surfing(e-goat rules prevent us from qouting from intranet documents not available on the internet)
Click to expand...

You can however summarise, the only restriction is quoting verbatim the document or linking to the intranet.

So you would not be breaking any rules by giving him the gist of what they say...
 
So the Wing Commander is happy to pay him, but not give him the rank?

Is he a bit dense?
 
Weebl said:
So the Wing Commander is happy to pay him, but not give him the rank?

Is he a bit dense?
Click to expand...

I would say not! He's quite happy to pay for it ( the slot is there so the funds are there). However, it might be a case of having too many SNCOs in a section which might upset a few ratios.
 
Belle and Sebastian said:
I would say not! He's quite happy to pay for it ( the slot is there so the funds are there). However, it might be a case of having too many SNCOs in a section which might upset a few ratios.
Click to expand...

If a Cpl can do the job (the post is rank ranged) then no need to give him his acting, if he cannot then no matter how much you pay him, he cannot carry out the duties of a Sgt without wearing it on his shoulder?

The ratio thing is a bit confusing, a Sgt goes and is replaced by your man with his acting, you are a Cpl down. Sgt does not get replaced, you are a Sgt down, either way the ratio gets twisted (except the CPL has to do his own job as well to get acting paid IIRC)
 
Downsizer said:
You can however summarise, the only restriction is quoting verbatim the document or linking to the intranet.

So you would not be breaking any rules by giving him the gist of what they say...
Click to expand...

The problem is that the paragraph I mentioned summarises the position pretty well. It is near impossible to give the gist without obvious plagiarism. I didn't want to get the site into trouble.
 
Subs pay is more common and can be given out whenever there is a gapped post for a minimum of 21 days.

Acting rank should only be used when it is absolutely necessary for oversigs or supervision purposes.

Sadly, the comments on this thread confirm my view that acting rank is thrown around like confetti these days - I seem to currently be on a Sqn where about 15% of the personnel are plastic in various ranks.
 
For acting rank to be awarded, the CO has to be content the higher rank is required for supervisory/managerial reasons. If the Cpl can do the Sgt's job and it doesn't require supervising other Cpls then SUPA without acting rank is entirely appropriate.

Since the authority to award acting rank (unpaid) was delegated to Stns a few years ago it has been given out too readily, in my opinion. For example, in one section at my unit, the WO's terminal leave has resulted in the FS, one Sgt and one Cpl all acting up, the net effect being zero. It's now so common that even a statement in an SJAR that an individual has been given acting rank for x-many months is largely ignored by promotion boards.

Edit: Damn you, MWD!
 
This is what happened to me.

Substitution pay - was still doing my own job with the added responsibility of the JNCO's position and had to step into do their shifts when there was no-one else avail.... I got this for approx 9 months then......

Awarded Acting Paid - when I could no longer do my own job and left behind all the responsibilities of that and only did the jobs of the JNCO including managing/supervising SAC's on our sqns OOH (just how our shifts at my secret locaion works). I got this for 14 months all together......

Then when there were enough JNCO's to do all the shifts back to Subby pay. Then finally picked up! :)
 
different situation

different situation

If you need the RANK to do the job then that is a different case.
But if the guy just wants "your friend" to do the SNCOs job AS WELL AS HIS CPL job then sub pay is the way to go. "your mate" gets a bit of extra dosh and the work gets done. No need to get the rank.

Think we have had this conversation before where the idea of Acting unpaid combined with subbie pay gets confused with SPAR where the rank is part of the deal.
You can be acting unpaid or just subbie pay no requirement to get both. Should still get written up in the SJAR though.
 
muttywhitedog said:
I seem to currently be on a Sqn where about 15% of the personnel are plastic in various ranks.
Click to expand...

Does this not tell you something? We have acted up a few people to deal with the AMM's punted in to our hanger (as in not employed in task they were recruited for) to ensure the correct level of supervision is there.

We're being asked to do more with less, one of the tools to achieve this is Acting Rank.
 
What it tells me is that acting rank is given out too easily.

We currently have 3 x Sqn WO's. One (the real one) who has just come back from an OOA, one who has been covering as Sqn WO whilst he was OOA, and one who replaced the Sqn WO OOA and is acting up. All get paid too.

The latter has only been a FS for a year so go figure!

Oh yes - we also have a Sgt acting as a FS for the FS who is OOA acting as a WO. And he is paid too.
 
Acting rank is fine the problem comes when it is removed. I'd feel uncomfortable removing the rank from someone who is doing the job and then has to return to the ranks. That shouldn't happen until posting
 
rest have risen above me said:
Acting rank is fine the problem comes when it is removed. I'd feel uncomfortable removing the rank from someone who is doing the job and then has to return to the ranks. That shouldn't happen until posting
Click to expand...

Fair point but I would think if the person is suitable for acting rank then they should be mature enough to realise and understand that at some point it will stop.

I see no reason not to use it if the option is there, makes no sense to me not to use everything at your disposal to make the job easier. And am I right in saying that paid acting rank can only be used when the post is vacant through being gapped etc? I.e., you can't pay someone if the post is vacant through an OOA or terminal leave etc? If that's the case then it's not costing any extra so where's the downside?
 
I suspect that you are right about the expectations of the person understanding that the rank is only acting, but it will inevitably lead to problems as due to our inconsistent promotion system. Someone who has the rank but does not get picked up may start getting bitter and twisted due to the fact of ,"I must be due promotion, I've done the job and proven myself so why aren't PMA promoting me?" this will affect that persons work etc . It may be more prudent to just let the person get on with it as senior (insert rank). This seems to me to be exascerbated when its JNCO to SNCO as the responsibility jump and lifestyle change is huge. If there's a way for this to include substitution pay then so much the better.
 
feckinG RANT said:
Fair point but I would think if the person is suitable for acting rank then they should be mature enough to realise and understand that at some point it will stop.

I see no reason not to use it if the option is there, makes no sense to me not to use everything at your disposal to make the job easier. And am I right in saying that paid acting rank can only be used when the post is vacant through being gapped etc? I.e., you can't pay someone if the post is vacant through an OOA or terminal leave etc? If that's the case then it's not costing any extra so where's the downside?
Click to expand...

I know of plenty of people getting acting paid whilst people are OOA. Or at least substitution pay and Acting rank at the same time.
 
The Dark Side said:
Can anyone give me the official gen on a query on acting rank.

a colleague has been informed by his boss (F/L) that he wants him to fill in for a Sgt, who is out soon. The Wing Co agrees to pay substitution pay but doesn't agree with acting rank. Is there policy on this?

Cheers in advance
Click to expand...
I think in a similar situation only getting the money would bother me. The higher rank, bigger badges, trinkets and baubles...that's just vanity. As long as he's getting paid for doing the job, that's all that matters.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top