Aircraft engineer log book

[Golfmk4]

Hi.

Im on my first year point in the raf doing my aircraft engineer apprenticeship and was considering on getting a log book where I could document all aircraft work I carry out, which would hopfully serve me well if I ever decide to leave the raf.

The only log book I seem to find is the CAA CAP 741 which is like a binder type log book

I was hoping for someone to shed some light as to whether this log book would be good for me or is there another log book out there I'm not too sure

Thanks

 

[Stevienics]

They used to issue a dark blue hardback "Aircraft Engineering Tradesman's Record of Training and Experience" post training. I still have mine.

 

[can't an SAC do it?]

Log Book

Log Book

As someone who left the RAF a few years ago and is now applying for a civvy B2 licence I would definitely recommend you keep your Blue Book (or whatever they issue nowadays) up to date. This is especially handy for proving experience, authorisations and training etc.

Furthermore, your RAF experience reduces the experience required for applying for a civvy licence to 1 year, not 5, but I expect that's dependant on how long you stay in.

Maybe someone on Air Tanker type a/c can advise better on how the RAF/ Civvy thing works.

 

[Cornish_Pikey]

They used to issue a dark blue hardback "Aircraft Engineering Tradesman's Record of Training and Experience" post training. I still have mine.

View attachment 14269

I still have mine, only entry was my name. It was supposed to be checked to be up to date by the boss at every posting of which there were many.

They never did check it once. Rarely even got an exit interview.

 

[Golfmk4]

They used to issue a dark blue hardback "Aircraft Engineering Tradesman's Record of Training and Experience" post training. I still have mine.

View attachment 14269

[footnote=]%[/footnote]

Do u know what raf form this is?

 

[Golfmk4]

As someone who left the RAF a few years ago and is now applying for a civvy B2 licence I would definitely recommend you keep your Blue Book (or whatever they issue nowadays) up to date. This is especially handy for proving experience, authorisations and training etc.

Furthermore, your RAF experience reduces the experience required for applying for a civvy licence to 1 year, not 5, but I expect that's dependant on how long you stay in.

Maybe someone on Air Tanker type a/c can advise better on how the RAF/ Civvy thing works.

What are the steps for applying for b1/2 licence?

What college did u go to to study and what's the cost like?

I'm new to the licence side of things so I was looking at heads up on things before I start applying.

Did u know about the raf paying for you to do an engineer degree?

 

[Stevienics]

Do u know what raf form this is?

Top right corner. Your eyes are better than mine

 

[Stevienics]

What are the steps for applying for b1/2 licence?

What college did u go to to study and what's the cost like?

I'm new to the licence side of things so I was looking at heads up on things before I start applying.

Did u know about the raf paying for you to do an engineer degree?

Whilst I admire your foresight, you can get all these answers from Cosford. I would crack on an try and make a decent fist of your career first, less anyone think your serving motivations are less than well-calibrated.

 

[vim_fuego]

Stevienics has a point...At least in your day job don't be asking too many of these questions all the time...keep your ears pinned back around disgruntled techies in their 8-12 year point and you'll probably hear everything you need to know anyway.

You are doing the right things though...The RAF is more a job than a career these days so do start to think about your exit plan relatively early then you can enjoy your time in much more knowing the future is golden whichever turn you take. Do start a degree or something using SLC's. Do start to pick up courses at whatever they call an education centre today...become a regular down there and let it be know to the OIC that you are keen to improve...You don't have to be overly truthful as to why. Make it so that by the time you are reaching any of your planned leaving points your CV is so compelling to an employer you barely have to interview before a contract arrives in the post.

I speak from experience...since leaving I've had two interviews and successfully started two jobs after a 25 year career.

P.S. If you're keen enough why not consider a commission and properly get on the gravy train?

 

[Rigga]

As a civvy aviation Quality Manager it is part of my job to review and assess the experiences listed in engineers Log Books. This is a job I do for potential employees just after CV sifting and quite regularly for certifying employees too as they still have to demonstrate their recency/experience for Commercial Air Transport.

From my Point of View it doesn't matter what format of Log you choose (most people like CAP 741) but make sure that your experiences are logged by Aircraft/Component Type and ATA Chapter - per page preferably.

Make sure you list at least 50% of the types of jobs listed in the back of the CAP741 and also make sure that you list some fault finding too - at least two different snags per ATA Chapter. All this will go towards your 1st Licence...the more the better.

If you get your licence and you go for a type rating, you will have to do another list of tasks too.

DON'T do the B2 if you're going for B1 and vice versa.

The RAF, in the 90's, used to have an A4 Portrait "Blue Folder" (something like "Record of Engineering Trades Experience") as a replacement for the (very) old Blue Book.

PS - Great advice from Vim Fuego...

 

[Golfmk4]

Thanks for all the replies.

I've applied for a few courses so hopfully this will improve my sjars.

The only problem I have with commission is I am too keen on staying as an aircraft engineer on mechanical as that's were my interest lies.

I plan to do at least 6-8 years anyways so I should have a great career and Cv by the end of it

 

[Stevienics]

Wise move

precious few JO's seem to have anything to do with actual engineering problem solving, with the emergence of equipment project teams who suck down every tiny engineering problem and convert it into a year long project.

 

[Keyser Söze]

To offer some realistic advice here. And introduce myself - I am B2/B1 + C with quite a few types - I served for 22+ yrs and have been out for 9+ yrs so I am getting to be an old duffer. The following is based on my experiences, and things may have changed now ; and they may change further by the time you get licenced

Yes, there is currently a reduction in time (from 5 yrs to 1 yrs) for appropriately experienced engineers to apply for the basic CAA Pt66 licence, but please dont think there is an opportunity to fast track yourself to becoming an LAE; it won't work! You will have served for 5 years (minimum) in an RAF aircraft maintenance environment.

Logbook - as long as you provide some suitable experience format (the CAP 741 is ok). As mentioned its going to be a good idea to have your log book in ATA chapt order (where possible) indicating the aircraft type and reg no, detailing the type of jobs for traceability. Show a good breadth and mix of scheduled and unscheduled tasks , fault fading, LRU changes etc plus the appropriate recovery procedure . Get the basic skills signed off. Your RAF aircraft experience, whilst important, is in my view, 'less' important than your (minimum 1 years) civilian experience in a Pt145 environment, following all the approved procedures and certified by B1/B2 type holders and then signed off by the quality dept, so don't sweat the RAF experience too much.

You used to be able to get your SEngO to sign these docs/log book entries off.

When you leave the RAF you (used to) get your quals and auth on a JPA print out this can also be used to provide extra proof of experience formally - the CAA like that.

The Pt 66 modules have a life (10 years) there are quite a lot to complete 12 + and you will have to get your licence in this 10 years, otherwise the modules expire. So theres a question of timing which you will need to manage. The licence modules are nt too difficult but don't take them for granted, you will have to get plenty of revision in or the possibility of failing the module increases and you then have to wait a few months before the resit (there are exceptions for the 147 providers).

Its good that you're thinking ahead for your future career, but its not a race, and the RAF can have different ideas which can make your life-plan tricky (ie post you somewhere off aircraft). So concentrate on your job in hand now, get your head down, learn all there is to know about the maintenance of aircraft, then in your last 2 years start studying your licences (don't boast about becoming an LAE and think you can avoid the less glamorous jobs at 3am on the ramp whilst you're in the RAF) so tread carefully, and good luck with your choices

 

[Keyser Söze]

What are the steps for applying for b1/2 licence?

What college did u go to to study and what's the cost like?

I'm new to the licence side of things so I was looking at heads up on things before I start applying.

Did u know about the raf paying for you to do an engineer degree?

Initially I found the process a little daunting but once you get to know the process its reasonably straight forward.
1 get all your licence modules completed
B1.1 mods 1-10, 11, 15, 17
B1.2 mods 1-10, 11, 16, 17
B1.3 mods 1-10, 12, 15
B2 mods 1-10, 13, 14

You 'll hear talk of 'higher level' modules which are appropriate for certain disciplines eg M5 is examined higher at B2 than it is for B1 etc - so investigate these things before you commit; If you have aspirations of gaining B1 & B2 then look carefully.

Experience: By all means, your RAF aircraft experience will count and the CAA do like to see plenty of bulk in your application submission. The important proof however will be the experience you will gain in civ' in a Pt 145 environment where you will have to demonstrate and document sufficient depth and breadth of knowledge, A civ LAE, will do everything from putting fuel in the ac, to diagnosing faults, changing LRUs, and writing MEL deferrals (LIMs/ADFs in your speak), duplicate inspections, plus all the accompanying documentation etc etc so he's a bit of a 1-man-band tbh. Then once you've got all the experience evidenced, you send it through to your pt145 Quality Manager, buy some doughnuts and ask him to Certify True Copies, So you keep all the originals and the CTC's go to the CAA together with a cheque for £330 - and wait for a couple of months and keep your fingers crossed. Then hopefully you'll get a nice surprise on you mat in the form of a secure delivery and inside you'll have a maroon wallet and inside will be your paper licence. What can you do now??? Well nowt really because all you've done now is be granted the 'basic' licence' (so no types) you'll then have to complete aircraft type courses (Q course) theory and practical then if its your first type will also have to prove 6 months documented experience to accompany the 'type' application and again send another cheques into the CAA