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Fitness/Gym during work

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Jayan

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Can anyone tell me where to find the AP/JSP (if there is one) which lays out our entitlement to how much time we are expected to spend on fitness.

Bit of a backstory to avoid obvious drama :)

I have a civvy boss who thinks one session a week is adequate, I try to go on weekends, but I have kids and other commitments meaning I don't go as often as I would like (hence not going on an evening!). I am not as young as I once was, so although I don't sit and eat pies, I still worry about the fatness test.

Is 3 times a week for 90mins a pi$$ take?
 
the old RI from Valley quoted something out of QR's saying that "its the airmans responsibility to maintain a standard level of fitness" or something like that. Not too sure which QR it is though
 
The main ref is a letter from AMP a few years back stating that each raf service person should have the opportunity of 5 sessions of phys per week. Phone the Ped staffs at 22gp on Monday, they will send it to you.
 
I don't want to **** on this but surely with all these cut backs and manning issues its upto the individual to do PT in their own time to keep fitness levels up (good attitude and all), after work, at lunch or if a shifty at night when there maybe some down time.......not when they should be doing their primary tasks.
We are lucky to have a small gym at work, as well as at my previous section so its not a big issue, but if we didn't we couldn't have got the time off for PT.
If the original poster is adamant he needs to shake off the lard and thinks he should be doing it in works time, maybe a case for compulsory PT for the whole section....we had that a Cosford.

I know I'm prob going to get some backlash for this...blah blah the RAF requires us to be fit so why shouldn't I do it in works time blah blah .......yes in days gone by you could prob use this, but now, let's face facts. We are shrinking force now with ongoing commitments, its upto the individual to stay fit in there own time and if they don't like it you know where the door is.

Anyway I'm out soon so I really don't care.....never been down the gym even the ones at work unless I was told to do compulsory PT and never failed a fitness test since it started.

SCJ
 
PT in work time

PT in work time

If I remember rightly when reading said APs/letters etc it is up to the individual to keep themselves fit and local commanders are encouraged/to ensure their personnel have access to 3 x 50 mins per week of pt, none of it states has to be in work time. I've never been to a camp that allows me, in work time, time off to attend pt sessions in all my 20 years of service. A bummer yes, but we knew the conditions of service when we volunteered to sign up. cup of corrrfeee
 
Sorry CJ, keeping fit is part of our primary duties nowadays. In recent years people have lost careers due to being unable to pass the fatness test, that isn't something that happened in the past. If anything time for fitness is another commitment that should be managed, not cut back on. If we can no longer do the other primary tasks you mention then the cutbacks have gone too far and policy has to change. Strong managers, from SNCO up, are required to make sure the impact isn't on the individuals long term, such as loss of pension.
 
Just like going for a dump, fitness imo should always be done in worktime...

In some ways the RAF is missing a trick here...if they insisted on mandatory PT as much as possible it gives them a baseline to throw people out who have a poor attitude to fitness more easily. The section holds it, ran by one of these section psuedo PTI's you have these days, and if folk don't turn up without good reason then a black mark is applied....if they turn out and put little effort in then a black mark is applied...if they fail the fitness test the evidence is already gathered.

If I was still serving, taking into consideration the importance of the fitness test these days, I'b be insisting that we had it...it's all a bit one way at the moment. If they want you to pass an exam at the end of a Tonka Q course do they train you? Do you get a go in a landrover before you get tested by MT? Before being declared combat ready as aircrew did they not give me an OCU plus up to 18 months of training flight first?

So why set a test and not back it up with suitable work time training?
 
I'm lucky that my Section has compulsory PT twice a week, we leave skeleton manning at work so that we don't have an impact on the rest of the station and all go to the gym. Recently it's become obvious that the same people are volunteering to be the skeleton manning and their NCOs have discussed this with them. As you say Vim it is an easy way to write up their attitude to fitness on SJARs. I used to play Station sport and for things like that I would volunteer to stay behind because I got my time off on other days. A lot of these guys are obviously just skiving though and the fear on their faces every six months is immense.
 
Joe_90 said:
Sorry CJ, keeping fit is part of our primary duties nowadays. In recent years people have lost careers due to being unable to pass the fatness test, that isn't something that happened in the past. If anything time for fitness is another commitment that should be managed, not cut back on. If we can no longer do the other primary tasks you mention then the cutbacks have gone too far and policy has to change. Strong managers, from SNCO up, are required to make sure the impact isn't on the individuals long term, such as loss of pension.
Click to expand...

Not possible with all jobs. I know people who works in the hospitals that have to cover committed shifts as part of a contract with the NHS. They cannot get away for PT during work time, they all do it in their own time, and yes they still so secondary/other station duties in their own time too so they remain competitive for promotion. They would love organised 'in work' PT time but it's my opinion they're disadvantaged.
 
Absolutely vital that phys is also conducted during work time as well. It needs to be managed appropriately but there is no reason for any section not being able to manage this. We are after all a fighting force!
 
My last 2 places have had completely different views on PT.

My current place has directed PT 3 times a week, which you are strongly encouraged to attend. If you dont attend and fail, you are in deep pooh. However if you attend and fail, then the pooh level drops dramatically.

Prior to that I worked in a BAe-run environment. There was no formal PT, but the working week finished at 1200 on a Friday - it was up to the individuals whether they used that time for PT or for driving home.

Strangely, there are more failures on my current unit - there are also more downgrades and people with exemption chits. I'm beginning to think that there is a link between too much PT and the number of broken people we currently have (approx 30 out of 150).
 
There will always be some that can't do it....those posts need to be managed so that the right people (highly motivated, good attitude to fitness etc) are placed in them but the idea shouldn't be disqualified because the minority feel disadvantaged...think about this...it's time away from work...do 30 mins of circuits together...pain is always better if you're sharing it...then get some footy, volleyball, badders or whatever going and see how your morale fairs after a few weeks whilst the fitness levels improve.

It's fair to say that the fitness test is here to stay...it can be soul destroying just pitching up to the gym and doing a bit of a run or cross train week in week out...circuits at Waddo were often jammed and full of the camp princesses annoyingly talking throughout...so insist that if you've got to do it you want it done properly with a plan, structure, aims and built in points where you can assess the effectiveness and maybe tweak to suit your guys...insist on support from the PTI's...if they are busy on expeds with the usual crowd insist they address something far more important like your section all passing the fitness test and above all, really above all, insist on those people who hold a commission to actually manage something like this...to actually roll their sleeves up, lead from the front and manage something for you instead of marking time in post for 18-24 months before hopping onto the next career step.
 
bubblebutt said:
Not possible with all jobs. I know people who works in the hospitals that have to cover committed shifts as part of a contract with the NHS. They cannot get away for PT during work time, they all do it in their own time, and yes they still so secondary/other station duties in their own time too so they remain competitive for promotion. They would love organised 'in work' PT time but it's my opinion they're disadvantaged.
Click to expand...

That's what I mean by managing it properly, if we are going to farm personnel out to civilian agencies then the contracts need to be written to take into account the fact we aren't civilians. The problem with that is it would require an officer to rock the boat somewhere which is career suicide.
 
Totally depends on your own managements attitude to fitness. I went through a short period of asking to get lads away on shift, to be told no repeatedly without (in my opinion) valid reason. I stopped asking and just send people anyway now, I find that management here usually haven't got the bottle to bollock me for sending the lads for some phys - as long as the work is done or in hand and we've got a bit of trade cover. I'm hoping that over time they'll just give up and it will be the norm.
 
It's policy without process...and that stinks of a management that wants to claim some success without facing up to the task.
 
Our station commander put out in orders that everyone was entitled to 2 hours a week within working hours to go to the gym, not that our boss would ever stop us I think, plus he's starting up a guided session every week as well - are we just the lucky/unlucky ones?
 
tats said:
Our station commander put out in orders that everyone was entitled to 2 hours a week within working hours to go to the gym, not that our boss would ever stop us I think, plus he's starting up a guided session every week as well - are we just the lucky/unlucky ones?
Click to expand...

Sounds like a good plan. I actually believe there should me a mandate from higher command that states ALL personnel WILL be entitled to attend 3 sessions of organised PT per week-in work time, aimed at increasing fitness to pass all necessary tests no matter where you work for the RAF. This has 2 benefits, 1 is we ensure staff have access to the necessary training regime to ensure they remain an effective 'warfighter' (that word keeps popping up), 2 is that there should be no excuses for not passing the fitness tests (injuries/medical reasons aside that is). PTI Circuits-not running where unfit people are pushed too hard are a great individual effort way of improving fitness for passing a fitness test.

If this isn't mandated then those people who can't get those 3 sessions per week should be excused fitness tests until they do have access. A time if you like for the higher command to put their money where their mouth is. If they want you fit for action they should support you for it.
 
The way I see it is this. The RAF require us to pass a test. Therefore they need to give us the time to practice for said test. If they were to send me on a course I wouldn't be doing that all in my own time would I?? Everyone should get the chance to go to PT sessions every week. I get one PT session a week from 8 - 9 and am back in work by 09.15. However I also go to the gym 3 lunch times a week on top of that. The only ones I dont are the day I do CPT and sometimes I get stuck at work and just cant get away. I leave work about 11.50 and I'm not back till 13.15 so that's also an extra 25 mins a day. Altogether a week then on average I spend what 2 and a half hours of works time in the gym a week. I think that is a pretty fair swap for a test that is mandatory for me to do.
 
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