Mech/Tech's

[wgaf]

Well said TBW. There are plenty of sh1t techies around wearing anything from LAC to FS rank slides. It doesn't matter what system you have trained under, sh1t will still sometimes get through.

As for not being a JT, apologies to all the old wizened "carpers" that I wasn't born/joined up earlier!

There is nothing wrong with the SAC(T) scheme, and I've no reason to believe the AMMs will be any better or any worse. There are plenty of good lads here who just keep their gob shut and watch and learn, as opposed to some JTs that swan around thinking they have the god given right to be an AVM or something just because they did a fitters course!!!

Soap box climbed down from satis.

But we were gods Monty ffs. Anyway being a thick plumber what the fekk would you know about being a real techie as opposed to 'bomb on and occasionally when you've fekked up bomb off'

 

[MontyPlumbs]

But we were gods Monty ffs. Anyway being a thick plumber what the fekk would you know about being a real techie as opposed to 'bomb on and occasionally when you've fekked up bomb off'

I'll let that pass as long as you aren't TG 2 scum.DT_Xtremez_14:

 

[Northern Monkey]

I was referring to AMM's on that one, of course there are JT's & SAC(T) who are simply there for the ride that will never change. As for making the best of things, good luck to you.DT_Xtremez_30:

Sorry dude, misread your quote! DT_Xtremez_42:

Weve had a lot of AMM's at our place and some seem really keen and are already getting their course dates through.
Whether they come out the other side any better is another thing?
DT_Xtremez_28:

 

[Tin basher]

Not actually true that though is it Tin me old mate? Yes, it happened but it wasn't built in to the system; there are probably quite a few SNCOs around today who started out as good old FLMs.

Quite right mate not every FLM got a fitters course some just did their time and left. I just gave a very rough and simplified overview of the 70's system as oppose to the 07's system. As you and I are fully aware there are far deeper issues but the two systems on the surface do seem remarkably similar vis not every AMM with get further training some will leave before then.

Off Topic Nice change of signature by the way Off Topic

 

[the_boy_wizard]

But we were gods Monty ffs. Anyway being a thick plumber what the fekk would you know about being a real techie as opposed to 'bomb on and occasionally when you've fekked up bomb off'

]

You seriously think JT's were gods? Maybe in the past, yes, but not any more! JT's are now the guys who complain and whinge all the time that "i've been in longer than you! I should be a CPL!"

Keep dreaming buddy boy! Its not "my day" any more!!DT_Xtremez_15:

 

[MontyPlumbs]

]

You seriously think JT's were gods? Maybe in the past, yes, but not any more! JT's are now the guys who complain and whinge all the time that "i've been in longer than you! I should be a CPL!"

Keep dreaming buddy boy! Its not "my day" any more!!DT_Xtremez_15:

Well said mate, but he was looking for a rise...methinks he got one DT_Xtremez_28:

 

[fat lazy techie]

Just to throw something else into the equation, how can we distinguish the AMM's that are now properly educated and completed their further training. Why don't we give them a different rank slide? How about a 4 bladed prop? What about a different rank title as well to go with it? Now what about Junior Technician say?

Who knows, in a couple of years we may have this novel idea of something called single trade mechanics. You never know it may just catch on. We may even go to pay bands that reflect your trade status and responsibility, not to mention your training.

 

[Tin basher]

Just to throw something else into the equation, how can we distinguish the AMM's that are now properly educated and completed their further training. Why don't we give them a different rank slide? How about a 4 bladed prop? What about a different rank title as well to go with it? Now what about Junior Technician say? Who knows, in a couple of years we may have this novel idea of something called single trade mechanics. You never know it may just catch on. We may even go to pay bands that reflect your trade status and responsibility, not to mention your training.

And people say I'm a cynicDT_Xtremez_15: . Nice idea thoughDT_Xtremez_28:

 

[MontyPlumbs]

And people say I'm a cynicDT_Xtremez_15: . Nice idea thoughDT_Xtremez_28:

I don't think we will ever see the resurgence of the JT rank, I think the BETT report said the RAF had to get rid of a rank, and JT was the fall guy. Remember, SAC Tech isn't technically a rank - thats how the RAF got round it!

 

[Hu Jardon]

As you can see there are vast and complicated differences between the two methods of training which has evolved over years of research and study.

What's up Tin Basher couldn't you spell stupidity?

DT_Xtremez_42:DT_Xtremez_30:DT_Xtremez_15:

 

[Sad git]

I think i got a good deal. No FT course to go on! And before anyone says anything, ive met JT's who needed supervision to pick their own noses, so they cant all be better than SACT's!

Probably DE'sDT_Xtremez_28:

 

[Geordie Ord]

In my 10 years at Cosford I have seen the wheel turn many times: Mechs, Fitters, Mech-Mechs, Mech-Techs, SAC Assim Techs, SAC Techs, AMMs and now Multi-Skilled Techs. Rumour has it that the next idea will be to train people for 3 years and pass them out as fully fledged Technicians, they are thinking about calling them “Apprentices”.

Although the RAF now looks set to stay on the multi-skilled route, as 007 once said “Never Say Never Again”.

Multi-skilling was being introduced in the mob 40 odd years ago. The front end of a JP (jet provost) disappeared courtesy of oil and grease with a dose of oxygen. Fortunately the multi-skilled engine tradesman was next to the oxygen trolley when the big bang occurred. I don't recall the outcome of the incident. Many years later in civvy street, multi-skilling raised its ugly head and I thought, "Here we go again". It turned out to be an excuse to give people a pay rise and things finally settled down with electricians being electricians and mechanical fitters being mechanical fitters and the multi-skilling component withered on the vine.
However, I must confess that the rigorous training of air force personnel in a given trade cannot need vast amounts of time and expense to get these people up to speed on other aspects of engineering. Multi-skilling is feasible and practicable, but it needs proper support in terms of quality training; committment on behalf of the trainees backed up by some incentive such as a badge and extra dosh! Sixty odd years ago, RAF groundcrew could rebuild a square yard of burnt and holed canvas into a Spitfire during a nightshift. I fancy their modern equivalents could do the same IF THEY HAD TO.

 

[Geordie Ord]

JT's who needed supervision to pick their ow

JT's who needed supervision to pick their ow

Probably DE'sDT_Xtremez_28:

Times have clearly changed. I clearly recall being posted to Boscombe Down in 1962 as a new J/T who had previously only worked on Chipmunks. The big stuff like Victors, Vulcans and Valiants were new to me. The SAC detailed to show me the ropes spent a lot of time bitching about how he had to show me around. In the end I just told him to show me the bits and I would explain to him how they all worked.
In my day it took almost a year of intensive training to climb from SAC to J/T. A few years later I was awaerded a First Class Honours degree in Engineering, but the pressure for my degree was never as intense as that on my Fitter's course.

 

[Goatherdingsplitter]

I don't think we will ever see the resurgence of the JT rank, I think the BETT report said the RAF had to get rid of a rank, and JT was the fall guy. Remember, SAC Tech isn't technically a rank - thats how the RAF got round it!

Betts also recommended that we go to an all technician Air Force and we ended up with the SAC(T); that lasted less than ten years before we were being told that we needed a semi-skilled element to undertake line-work and trade assist (AMM). That's why we used to have Mechs (and FLMs) FFS!!

 

[Soon To Leave]

Probably DE'sDT_Xtremez_28:

In the case of DE's, the filtering was done before they even joined the RAF.

DE's were cream of the crop. Specially selected to bypass LAC and SAC ranks and able to learn in 18 months what the Apprentices took 3 years to aquire. Any remaining DE J/T's should have been promoted years ago.

 

[Sad git]

In the case of DE's, the filtering was done before they even joined the RAF.

DE's were cream of the crop. Specially selected to bypass LAC and SAC ranks and able to learn in 18 months what the Apprentices took 3 years to aquire. Any remaining DE J/T's should have been promoted years ago.

Only DE's saw themselves as the cream of the crop. The SAC's and JT's via fitters courses certainly didn't I still hold that one against me DE mate after 25 years.DT_Xtremez_30: To be honest what difference does it realy make you get w@nkers at every level regardless of their training route.

 

[Defender of the universe]

i am gay....................

 

[Hu Jardon]

DT_Xtremez_28: DT_Xtremez_41:

i am gay....................

Yes we all know but we thought you wanted it kept quiet

And bye the way you've left yourself loogged in too haven't you,

DT_Xtremez_42:

 

[Swingwinger]

DT_Xtremez_28: DT_Xtremez_41:
Yes we all know but we thought you wanted it kept quiet

And bye the way you've left yourself loogged in too haven't you,

Schoolboy error!!

 

[gemarriott]

In the case of DE's, the filtering was done before they even joined the RAF.

DE's were cream of the crop. Specially selected to bypass LAC and SAC ranks and able to learn in 18 months what the Apprentices took 3 years to aquire. Any remaining DE J/T's should have been promoted years ago.

You certainly didn't meet some of the DEs I did then!

Their first 6 months out of training was spent teaching them enough sense to come in ou of the bloody rain. The next 6 months was spent knocking the "I'm too good to do a bf/AF/TR, I'm a DE" out of them and the next year spent actually teaching the useless cnut the job. A few turned into half decent tradesmen but as for cream of the crop you were being sarcastic surely?