SDSR15 - thoughts? crystal ball time?

[Dan_Brown]

I've recently returned from a course with mixed trades and several commented on SDSR15.

Just curious as no-one had read anything on it, just their opinions that further redundancies were coming.

Any thoughts, anyone seen any documentation that supports this (i missed out last round).

 

[Keyser Söze]

perhaps you may be better off by looking back at recent history. War end = manpower reduction.

happened in early 90's after GW1
happened early 2000's after GW2

WILL happen after this debacle,,,,,, the only decision will be (by those who don't give a flying feck about yous) whether if they can p1ss as many people off as possible in the mean time, they will PVR and they (i.e. the gov') will save money by there not being that many guys left still serving to make redundant ..... your choice whether you wanna bend over and take the pineapple or smell the coffee

 

[Dan_Brown]

Very true, but with a hint of bitterness/venom?

I'm fast approaching my exit date, so to jump ship now would be silly (pension trap). They can throw as much sh!t as they want, i'm not budging until i collect the IP!

An interesting thing for me was, i have seen/heard many people from my trade pushing the button and to me it seemed a huge increase from past years, but speaking to the powers that be, they keep saying that the pvr rate is the norm; really?

 

[Joe_90]

PVR and ET are two different things, I asked the CASWO the same thing about my trade. Fair play he looked into it but the answer was the same as yours, PVR's are stable. Early Terminations from those past 22 were through the roof, my reply didn't mention that though. That came out from the Trade Sponsor a few months later.

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[Dan_Brown]

PVR/ET, what i was referring to was people leaving before their engagement end.

We've recently had a Sgt who is less than 1 year in rank jump ship - no plans etc, just had had enough.

 

[4everAD]

Don't forget the most anyone can get under the new redundancy scheme will be 3 months pay excluding IP etc.

 

[Keyser Söze]

Very true, but with a hint of bitterness/venom? lol yeah possibly looking back at my post although I would say it was borne from experience rather than bitterness. I was just a bit late to realise it

I'm fast approaching my exit date, so to jump ship now would be silly (pension trap). They can throw as much sh!t as they want, i'm not budging until i collect the IP! agreed stay in and collect what is due

An interesting thing for me was, i have seen/heard many people from my trade pushing the button and to me it seemed a huge increase from past years, but speaking to the powers that be, they keep saying that the pvr rate is the norm; really?

PVR and ET are two different things,

Really? I did nt know that, (I thought PVR was pre JPA language whilst ET was the in phrase) IMHO its the bean counters playing the semantics game. In reality,,, man x is signed on for y number of years if he volunteers to be released early/prematurely then who cares what they call it ...Early termination or Premature Early Release WGAF the bloke has left the building sooner than was agreed whether the bloke has completed his 22 and is on LOS 30 is an irrelevance,, but then again its just my opinion.

 

[Joe_90]

I was the same and didn't realise the difference. I certainly felt like I'd been given a politicians answer, true but obviously not what I meant.

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[Spearmint]

Does it not say on JPA (Self Service), first column of options, 'Apply For Early Termination'?

 

[Joe_90]

I'm giving the men at the top the benefit of the doubt here. Either I was lied to after my initial question which was "Is there an issue with PVR's in the trade at the moment?" I was told no, they are about historical norms. Two months later the trade sponsor announces that there were real issues with ET and they requested ideas on how to stop it. If my first two posts about about PVR and ET were wrong I apologise.

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[Keyser Söze]

no need to apologise Joe, it just goes to show that there are credibility issues with the CASWO simply sticking to the party line.....doing the Jedi mind trick "there's nothing to see here, move along"

4 years ago I was told PVR rates are 'within norms', I however was of a different opinion with so many of my ( TG1 ) mates leaving in high numbers, this opinion was reached by the number of top tables I was attending.

 

[Spearmint]

The other day, my Wobbly held an informal briefing with us all post meeting with the TG Sponsor of TG1.

Mentioned was the new pay spine designed to help correct the absolute sh1te that Pay2000 is and maybe alleviate the PVR situation. (Apparently, the Sponsors words.)

It boils down to 4 tiers. The Winged Master Race in the top tier, Techies in the second and everything else in the bottom two.

I'll believe it when I see it.

 

[ady eflog]

You really believe they will bring back techie pay? I cant see it myself, they will just up the promotion quota to fill the gaps and recruit more erks. With the drawdown of the Tristar and VC10 fleets, Tonkas at Lossie etc. its masking the problem. Enev with the problems with a lack of trained manpower at the coal face which has been highlighted by the reports in the past few months it wont make any difference. The RAF is dead to techies, an amazing choice of half a dozen bases and no morale. joy.

 

[FootTapper]

Don't forget the most anyone can get under the new redundancy scheme will be 3 months pay excluding IP etc.

Taken from
https://www.gov.uk/redundant-your-rights/redundancy-pay


3. Redundancy pay
You’ll normally be entitled to statutory redundancy pay if you’re an employee and you’ve been working for your current employer for 2 years or more.

You’ll get:

half a week’s pay for each full year you were under 22
1 week’s pay for each full year you were 22 or older, but under 41
1 and half week’s pay for each full year you were 41 or older


I appreciate that members of HM Forces are not entitled to SRP.

But 3 months pay is ~ 13 weeks pay, so for example that's:
13 years service between age 22 and 41. or
Joined age 18, served until age 33

Anyone who'd served longer than the above but only received 3 month's pay would be getting less than the equivalent SRP?

 

[busby1971]

Taken from
https://www.gov.uk/redundant-your-rights/redundancy-pay


3. Redundancy pay
You’ll normally be entitled to statutory redundancy pay if you’re an employee and you’ve been working for your current employer for 2 years or more.

You’ll get:

half a week’s pay for each full year you were under 22
1 week’s pay for each full year you were 22 or older, but under 41
1 and half week’s pay for each full year you were 41 or older


I appreciate that members of HM Forces are not entitled to SRP.

But 3 months pay is ~ 13 weeks pay, so for example that's:
13 years service between age 22 and 41. or
Joined age 18, served until age 33

Anyone who'd served longer than the above but only received 3 month's pay would be getting less than the equivalent SRP?

Couple of facts missing there, SRP is capped, at around 400 odd pound, and if I remember rightly the Armed Forces are not covered by the legal protections covered by SRP. Rather oddly this second fact is repeated in your link.

Any misunderstandings above caused by predictive texf

 

[4everAD]

As said armed forces are exempt from srp, the previous "generous" amounts were kept in place until the current round of very high profile redundancies are completed. It then switches to the very ungenerous 3 months maximum. Strange that this might tie in with the ability for very targeted redundancies in the future mentioned in the nem brief I attended. Call me a cynic but lets say in 2 years time when they decide they don't need your services anymore under sdsr 15 but you've got 12 years left on your "contract" 3 months pay won't seem a lot and Joe public won't care as we're out of Afghan etc.

 

[Keyser Söze]

Wobbly held an informal briefing with us all post meeting with the TG Sponsor of TG1.

Mentioned was the new pay spine designed to help correct the absolute sh1te that Pay2000 is and maybe alleviate the PVR situation. (Apparently, the Sponsors words.)

It boils down to 4 tiers. The Winged Master Race in the top tier, Techies in the second and everything else in the bottom two.

I'll believe it when I see it.

I suspect its just BS with the TS giving some good news in an otherwise bleak environment,, bet Wobbly could nt wait trying to keep his guys onside,,,can't see it happening for the following reasons:

1. It would publicly prove that all those clowns who sanctioned Pay2000 were totally wrong.
2. When Techie pay was around techie trades were amongst the longest and technically hardest training , that aint the case any longer.
3. No techies were disadvantaged during P2000 (yawn).
4. There are too many techies working in backwater jobs for their whole/lengthy parts of their career (no shifts, relatively limited responsibilities, etc).
5. P2000 effectively brought the OR pay spine into line with that of officers, namely they (officers) all get paid the same irrespective of their branch,,, why can't the great unwashed manage it?
5. No techies were hurt in the making of this post

 

[Barch]

5. P2000 effectively brought the OR pay spine into line with that of officers, namely they (officers) all get paid the same irrespective of their branch,,, why can't the great unwashed manage it?

Do the winged master race still get flying pay?

 

[Keyser Söze]

Do the winged master race still get flying pay?

yes but that is 'special pay' for special people

All F/Ls, get paid the same, all Wg Cdr's get paid the same basic salary (based upon their rank) then increment through their pay-scale annually, irrespective of branch however certain specialists get specialist (taxable) allowances e.g. flying pay

 

[FootTapper]

Couple of facts missing there, SRP is capped, at around 400 odd pound, and if I remember rightly the Armed Forces are not covered by the legal protections covered by SRP. Rather oddly this second fact is repeated in your link.

Any misunderstandings above caused by predictive texf

The only thing odd about it is you mentioning it, when it's also included in my narrative - where I said "I appreciate that members of HM Forces are not entitled to SRP" The point of the post was that since HMF *aren't* entitled to SRP then it seems reasonable to at least compare the figures.

And I'm not sure that your first fact is, in fact, a fact - a £400 cap on SRP would mean anyone earning £10k a year would hit the SRP cap as soon as they qualified for it.