Welcome to E-Goat :: The Totally Unofficial Royal Air Force Rumour Network
Join our free community to unlock a range of benefits like:
  • Post and participate in discussions.
  • Send and receive private messages with other members.
  • Respond to polls and surveys.
  • Upload and share content.
  • Gain access to exclusive features and tools.
Join 7.5K others today

SJAR Service Complaint?

  • Following weeks of work, the E-GOAT team are delighted to present to you a new look to the forums with plenty of new features. Take a look around and see what you think!
Trending This Week
View More Trending
T

Trabelaine

LAC
12
0
0
I know I'm not the first, and definitely won't be the last to be disputing how they got on with the promotion board this year, but I want to run my case by some impartial experts first before I wind up making an idiot of myself.

To summarise what's below - I've been graded a 'C' on the board because my rec was 'dev' which I think is a mistake, so I'm considering a Service Complaint. I may not change that rating now, but I at least want answers to see what happened. Do I have a case?

I'm an SAC(T) who's just been posted out after 5 years within a section from training. It was a demanding post working with the Typhoon, with many dets, including Op Ellamy, away and needed good technical knowledge to be competent at the job. When I left I was the longest SAC in post and easily a 'go-to-guy' for technical questions for most things and had had a hand in shaping many of our working processes over the years.

Anyway, my issue now is, I found out last month that I had been graded a 'C' on our board, and to sum up how that felt my new Sergeant had to ask me 'What did you do so wrong?', and I couldn't answer him, because I don't know. On looking into it, I found that I'd been marked as 'Dev' on the recommendations tab. Now, either I'd overlooked this at the time, or it was changed after I saw it. There's a number of factors into my thinking that this is a mistake -

#I was a B grade the 2 years before, and now have a 'high rec' on my 'on posting' SJAR (which I've now triple-checked over), so this one SJAR is a big anomaly.

#I wasn't made specifically aware that I was now suddenly a 'dev' category. There's a tick box on the recommendations tab for notifications of significant changes, left empty.

#The write up and gradings don't match for a dev, having compared with my first SJAR as a new SAC and had my FS and Sgt look over it, there's things like 'gave briefings up to SO2', 'saved the MOD £100,000', 're-wrote and refined processes', which obviously as a new SAC when I really was a dev I didn't have.

#Most of the correspondence between me, my 1st RO and 2nd RO was done over the phone and e-mail because my 1RO was posted in Feb, and the SJAR was finalized in April.

#On the first draft I saw that my Insert Slip from a 4 month det was missing. I had to chase this up myself and it was finally in after 2 weeks and my 1RO twice saying it was 'all OK', but still missing.

#On the reporting chain, there's a 3 week gap between my last input and the 1RO, 2RO and admin's input. I may be looking too far into this, but I don't know what was changed during this time, so I'd like to.

#I was distracted by my personal life. Never a real excuse, I know, but I got married in April which obviously took up my time, and my wife was very ill leading up to it with treatment for a miscarriage (1 of many this past 2 years). On a personal note, I'd considered my 1RO a friend up to this point - the year before I worked with him on a number of UK trips and 1 to Europe where he was understanding when I had to support my wife and look after my son through the miscarriages. So, I trusted him to see that everything was OK with this SJAR. I don't want this to turn into a rant but the impact this has now had on me are sleepless nights (Doc's prescribed Temazepam) and a big lack of motivation at home with my wife and son, and in work.

#Right before getting married and just as my SJAR was being finalized I had leave, which I'd requested the year before whilst on det, and somehow it was 2 days out so that I thought I was off, but work thought I shouldn't have been. This resulted in a call into work (only after I'd already 'missed' a day) and a serious dressing down in the boss' office which I never really understood. Did this 'falling out' impact my SJAR?

#I wasn't expecting a promotion or top 'A' grade, but at least to keep in line with my past SJARs and current 'high-rec' SJAR. This now impacts my next grading when it gets to the board and they look at past SJARs. This is my career.

#I've contacted my 1RO through email, which was initially ignored, but then after meeting with my Chief Clerk who phoned to ask about the 'dev', his response to him was that he couldn't recall talking to me about being a 'dev'. I then messaged on Facebook saying 'Why did you mark me as dev and not tell me?', then the day after I got a page long, formal email going into what would have happened (as per JSPs) and that if I had a problem with it at the time I should have raised it then, and to go to P1 now if I have issues. To be honest, I skimmed it because it was so generalised (I don't think it's all his writing) and on realizing this 'friend' was now hiding behind procedures I closed it before losing my temper.

So my next logical step is unfortunately a Service Complaint. I love the Air Force and everything I've got from it so far, but if I'm to continue my career with it, I need to progress from SAC, and need answers from what's gone wrong. Taking a devil's advocate view for a second, if an experienced SAC is being marked as developing, then something's gone wrong, either I've seriously ****ed up, or my management's ****ed up. I'm trying to curb my own expectations so I'd at least like the management involved to recognise that an experienced SAC isn't 'dev', and at best, I want my SJAR redone, regraded, and a heartfelt apology (never happening, I know).

If anyone does have the time to read this, then input would be appreciated.
 
Just to give you a heads up.

firstly your grievance seems very complicated and without a doubt I'm sensing two sides to this story.
Not for one minute am I taking sides.

Secondly, a SC is an option but you MUST have evidence that something has been done wrong.
You CAN NOT just put in a SC on any matter you wish.
Well, actually you can....but it won't be accepted or progressed on.

You could be the very best SAC in the entire world...but if your 1st RO doesn't see you displaying NCO qualities....then your a 'Dev'.

good luck 👍🏻
 
Downsizer said:
Two questions, did you get an MPAR? And second when you ticked that you have no comments why didn't you notice the Dev then?
Click to expand...

Yes I had an MPAR.

I didn't notice the Dev then because of the reasons I gave - my concentration was on the write up, on the one mistake I did notice being the missing insert slip, made difficult by having it given to me through a phone conversation and email, by my mind being on my marriage and sick wife, my trust in a 1RO I'd had plenty of experience with, I didn't expect to see myself down as a dev, I've never had training or a course on SJARs (twice I booked on a workshop but cancelled because of work, and am now on one in April hopefully)...I could go on.
 
Last edited:
Trabelaine said:
Yes I had an MPAR.

I didn't notice the Dev then because of the reasons I gave - my concentration was on the write up, on the one mistake I did notice being the missing insert slip, made difficult by having it given to me through a phone conversation and email, by my mind being on my marriage and sick wife, my trust in a 1RO I'd had plenty of experience with, I didn't expect to see myself down as a dev, I've never had training or a course on SJARs (twice I booked on a workshop but cancelled because of work, and am now on one in April hopefully)...I could go on.
Click to expand...

You keep going on about 'trust'

The SJAR system is designed to be open and certainly not open to abuse or relying on trust.

You had every opportunity to see the promotion recommendation and by accepting the SJAR with no comment, you certainly 'signed' off as agreeing to its contents.

You weren't 'duped' or 'tricked' into accepting something which wasn't fully within your capability to review.

Sorry mate, but you don't have a leg to stand on.

Maybe, your not really showing NCO qualities, by signing off on something as important as your own SJAR without reviewing its contents fully.

Most people look at the recommendation before reading the narratives, I'm puzzled that you didn't even look at it at all.
 
Ringo said:
You keep going on about 'trust'

The SJAR system is designed to be open and certainly not open to abuse or relying on trust.

You had every opportunity to see the promotion recommendation and by accepting the SJAR with no comment, you certainly 'signed' off as agreeing to its contents.

You weren't 'duped' or 'tricked' into accepting something which wasn't fully within your capability to review.

Sorry mate, but you don't have a leg to stand on.

Maybe, your not really showing NCO qualities, by signing off on something as important as your own SJAR without reviewing its contents fully.

Most people look at the recommendation before reading the narratives, I'm puzzled that you didn't even look at it at all.
Click to expand...

So let's hypothesize that in a moment of weakness I did indeed not show my NCO qualities when I ticked off on it. That lapse is now something I and my family must live with?

Also, as I've said, I'm an SAC and hadn't expected promotion yet. If the SJAR system requires 'NCO Qualities' to be shown by subjects, why ask an SAC to sign it?
 
Last edited:
Trabelaine said:
So let's hypothesize that in a moment of weakness I did indeed not show my NCO qualities when I ticked off on it. That lapse is now something I and my family must live with?
Click to expand...

The point is, on what you written here, I don't believe you have a valid reason for an SC.

You had an MPAR, your SJAR I'm assuming reads okay.

For your recommendation to be a 'DEV', your potential narrative MUST have given plenty of advice on what you could do to become a 'YES'.

Your 2nd RO would also have needed to give a recommendation. I'm guessing also a 'DEV'

So now you have 2 ROs saying your a 'Dev'

Its a bit late now, after you signed off 'no comment', to say you feel aggrieved.
That is exactly what the '5 days' you get to review the SJAR are for.

What concerns me the most, is that you thought your friendship with your 1st RO, would guarantee you a 'yes'.

Did he ever actually tell you....during the reporting year, that he was going to give you a 'yes' ??

What did the MPAR say ??

If if he hasn't given you any pointers in the MPAR, and it looks as though you have been misled on your performance and potential in that MPAR, you may have a chance.

But an MPAR is only a guide. It would need to be a huge contradiction in terms, to have that as your only piece of evidence.
 
People missing the point here and just pushing me down on a point I addressed in my original post.
I'm an SAC.
I didn't expect promotion.
When I asked questions about the SJAR that I didn't understand on I was told it was a 'good SJAR'.
I'm not here for an argument, else I'd be down the pub.
 
I hate to say it mate... But everything that has been said above are all valid points, whether you like it or not.

I learnt very early on in my career that when it comes to SJARs etc.. You take your time, you dot every I, you cross every T and you check and double check everything before you are happy and sign on the dotted line.

If the scuffers had been that sharp, I would have been charged at least four times more than I actually was....
 
One thing.... When you had your Mid-term appraisal, were you verbally debriefed on it and told what to do to improve?
 
It looks as if you've a harsh lesson to learn here. I would advise in future to thoroughly check anything you put your name to and keep a copy of your MPAR to refer to as you can only be marked down in your SJAR if you have done nothing to rectify as suggested by your mid-term.
 
I used to give briefs to my Sqn personnel about taking ownership of their report, making sure their objectives were up to date etc. For some, I was ****1ng in the wind because they couldn't be ar$ed. For others, it was an eye-opener as to what was required for them to get on.

Unsurprisingly, the ones who paid attention to The Sqn Adjt's words seemed to get the better reports and earlier promotion, as the mantra amongst the SNCOs was "If they cant be ar$ed to take ownership of getting the basics right on their own report, then why should I bust a gut wiping their backsides when they are showing no NCO qualities".

It was your report and you accepted the 1RO's comments and recommendation. To put it bluntly mate, if you want to raise a SC, then raise it against the face you see in the mirror.
 
Maybe your 1st & 2nd RO feel that, in this RP, you have yet to show that you are NCO material (in their opinion). Remember, they should have discussed the content of the report before presenting it to you. Unless the SJAR system has changed radically in the last year, a 'rogue' assessment would usually be looked at as such by the PSB, and potentially given lesser weight than previous ones. Everyone has a 'ceiling' and although people of all non-commissioned ranks do a lot of great things, maybe in this day and age with vastly fewer numbers, your hierachy are being more picky about who they recommend.

Concur with the previous posters though. You need to read it all before you hit the no comments box.
 
How does your potential read on the SJAR? Were there any development points in the MPAR / SJAR? Have you ever held acting Cpl?

I fear that in not noticing your DEV grading, you've probably not got a leg to stand on tbh...but I'm no expert in such things so by all means go ahead and try and resolve this. It really should've been a major discussion point in your interview.

If you put a SC in, what outcome do you want? To my knowledge, no SC has resulted in a promotion board resitting.

You need to think carefully about how you present yourself in this period. You're not only taking on the now departed 1st RO, but the whole management team and they'll be assessing you next time around. If the Chief Clerk thinks you have a strong case and that the SC will bring you a positive outcome, then by all means push it forward. If not, then put it down to experience and get your head down and make sure you perform well the for the next SJAR. Promotion gradings arent kisses of death that linger, you can get promoted from a singleton grade above DEV. Accepting this situation and moving on could be the best course of action for you and your sanity.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top