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Questions for TG4 Trade Sponsor

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Pause for thought?

Pause for thought?

Happy Christmas to all goats!

This thread has taken on an interesting detour. On the subject of manpower, allow me to add this thought to the already brimming pot of ideas.

Don't butcher areas of 90SU that provide a supporting role to TCW. Instead chop 10% off all squadrons and wings manpower, thus downsizing proportionately.

I am sure guys in ERAS and RAID to name but a few would appreciate this as they would not be decimated entirely. As for TCW, I am sure each Squadron could sacrifice 20 bods to the cause? I gather there are plenty of junior officers about according to previous threads?? Justification to keep these positions could be debated among the decision makers?

This approach would surely allow 90 to function more efficiently should the axe need to be wielded!
 
Last Outa Locking said:
Happy Christmas to all goats!

This thread has taken on an interesting detour. On the subject of manpower, allow me to add this thought to the already brimming pot of ideas.

Don't butcher areas of 90SU that provide a supporting role to TCW. Instead chop 10% off all squadrons and wings manpower, thus downsizing proportionately.

I am sure guys in ERAS and RAID to name but a few would appreciate this as they would not be decimated entirely. As for TCW, I am sure each Squadron could sacrifice 20 bods to the cause? I gather there are plenty of junior officers about according to previous threads?? Justification to keep these positions could be debated among the decision makers?

This approach would surely allow 90 to function more efficiently should the axe need to be wielded!
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Interesting that people seem to think that FGW are just there to support TCW. ERAS dont give a feck what TCW are up to. 5 Sqn have to support the Mickey Mouse MRX phase, but most of their work has no TCW input.

The sooner people on 90SU realise that TCW are not as important as they think they are, the better.
 
mad_collie said:
The sooner people on 90SU realise that TCW are not as important as they think they are, the better.
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I'm shocked!! Surely NO-ONE on TCW has an inflated sense of importance:0

The way i see it is TCW are the expiditionary arm of 90SU, FGW are the static element whom in certain areas provide support to TCW.

the sqn's could lose the mentioned 10% easily, and i'm certain there are plenty areas where manpower could be rationalised, too many cooks on 90SU, too many decisions to make change..followed by revisiting said decision when the replacement comes in ( prob a wider prob than just 90SU).

the aforementioned mis use of Tg4 peeps is a disgrace, and indicitave of an orginisation that feels it has the right to every single bit of manpower it desires, then allows it's personnel to create b*llsh*t little jobs to suit their own needs.

But to be fair I quite enjoy it most the time, the whole thing just needs tweaking a bit. manning could do with being a touch more robust in sharing the love a bit, too many people never do 90SU, too many people spend far too in their litle comfort zones, I'm amazed just how many people have so little experience outside TCW, there are Cpl's and snec's who have done nothing else.

hey ho, best go got a beer awaiting me:PDT_Xtremez_30:
 
its all well and good talking about loosing 10% off each sqn but when the time comes and all the trade staff from bases go to 90su after DII and JAMATS then realistally we should reall be talking a good 20 -30 % off the Trade as a whole let alone just 90SU .
 
also why is there no yeoman or foreman career path , feel like sometimes there is nothing to strive for in this trade....
 
ITgeek said:
its all well and good talking about loosing 10% off each sqn but when the time comes and all the trade staff from bases go to 90su after DII and JAMATS then realistally we should reall be talking a good 20 -30 % off the Trade as a whole let alone just 90SU .
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They already have the 'post DII' MOB posts covered... TG4 peeps will be carrying out the role of IM advisers. There is even a 4002 course in the pipeline to cater for this. I think JMATS is behind schedule, plus with MOD budget cuts may be put back further (pure speculation on my part).

There are some new posts popping up; diverse jobs that this diverse trade could do with. I'm talking RAF Regt, TIW, overseas etc. There is an article on Typhoon GSS in the latest ICT Warrior. With JSF coming in maybe we will be involved in a similar manner.

We still have posts with the fitting team, Brampton, London, Cheltenham, Digby.

So maybe we won't all end up on TCW! We just need the trade sponsor to fight for posts and for us all to be a bit more positive..!

As for 90SU, the biggest gripe I have heard from people is the location. If it wasn't in Yorkshire and moved south then maybe more people would be up for it.
 
unruly1986 said:
So maybe we won't all end up on TCW! We just need the trade sponsor to fight for posts and for us all to be a bit more positive..!QUOTE]

Ha Ha I was talking about this with someone the other week, It's amazing how many of the new Tg4 come to 90SU and believe that it all there is in the trade.

There has been talk for years about slots with the army, to do with real time battleground pictures, along with all the DII stuff, the fact that everything has a PC in it these days and he fact we cant afford to replace our legacy equip, I suspect our trade is secure in the long term.

And yes you are right, Leeming is a big issue, a grim, remote camp with poor infrastructure. Not so much a yorkshire issue in my opinion, just a poor base with all housing behind the wire.........cue a load of wifes trapped in each others pockets with nothing to do but stir sh*t.
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the silver glove said:
unruly1986 said:
Ha Ha I was talking about this with someone the other week, It's amazing how many of the new Tg4 come to 90SU and believe that it all there is in the trade.
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As ive being through the Radio school in the last couple of year i can see why that is , All we get Shoved down our throats is TCW and SF Comms. ever other week there is a "compulsary" briefing about it and 90% of the instructors down there are ex TCW.. when you do find the gems in the sand u do find out about other areas to go i.e. spadeadam and raf reg postings..... but most people dont go looking cuase they have baught into the propaganda.

And for the lads that think "oh i might go for SF Comms at somepoint in the future , they are told that they will not even get looked at unless they come from TCW"
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All this you'd thing the new TG4 lads think the only people who deploy in the trade are 90SU. Mind you in about a year they might be if 1ACC gets binned.
 
I am also `new breed TG4` and can see why so many of the new guys think TCW is the be all and end all of this trade. I was also brainwashed into the SF Comms/TCW super soldier thing at 1RS and wanted TCW out of training, but didn't get it, (was top of the dreamsheet as well..!). At the time I was gutted as I went to a MOB.

Looking back I am so glad that I didn't go there. Not because I am a det dodging softy, or because I don't like Leeming, but because my eyes have been opened to the wider TG4 and more importantly the wider RAF. From the TCW guys I've come across, many seem to forget that we are here to support aircraft at the end of the day, not just RAF comms and DII.

That said, if/when I'm posted to 90SU/TCW at some point in the future I'll give it 100% and be keen to learn and work hard.

Now back to questions to the TS:

When are you going to push for TG4 to have more posts in the diverse jobs I mentioned earlier?

Will TG4 be more involved in the Cyber Warfare/Security side of things talked about in the recent SDSR? As a technical IT/Comms trade, surely with some additional specialist training we are best suited for this?

Assuming Afghan drawdown takes place, affecting 90SU, and DII/F comes in as planned affecting MOB pers, will TG4 have to reduce in size?
 
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dont get me wrong , the Royal sigs guys are good at what they do , but when i worked with them on ex in the past they have always said they where short man'd.

and the job covers at lot of our role . there was a RLI LAN for the HQ and ground to air radios supplied by the army. then a RAF TG4 tech out supporting all the stand alone IT kit.


dont see why we couldn't supply a squadron to suppliment there setup as it stands
 
Three interesting points brought up over the last few days.

First - why so many junior officers? I remember sitting through a brief last year about SDSR by an AVM stating "cuts will only come at staff level"- interesting to see how many of the 5000 that will be!

Secondly- Why cant we do JHC, working with a sigs regt now ill tell you now not in a month of sundays are the army going to let the RAF loose on any of their jobs never mind close support.

Thirdly- Downsizing, all this drawdown of TG4, how many redundancies will be offered for this trade, or are they going to do the usual of just p%£"ing everyone off till they leave. Cut back of promotion quota a good start perhaps?!!!
 
A bit of a boring history lesson regarding support to SH

Up until 1992 TCW spent a large amount of its time supporting the SH force. Following "Options for Change" at the end of the Cold War the Army and RAF made a formal agreement about who would support what in the future . It ended up as roughly RAF = fixed wing, Army = rotary.

In August 1992 this saw TCW lose almost half its strength when 244 Sig Sqn departed for Colerne and become part of 21 Sig Regt. TCW then began to move away from the small "Tactical" Clansman dets and focus on the "strategic" stuff. Satcomm (501) had arrived at the back end of 91 and completely changed TCWs capabilities, there was also talk of some mysterious new comms system called RTTS that was on its way.

So this is why the Sigs do all the SH stuff.

244 were a sad loss and TCW changed dramatically - however it ensured the RAF maintained its own deployable comms capability which has to be a good thing......doesn't it????????
 
If I was the Trade Sponsor, which I am, I would send me an email at my Halton address or alternatively phone me up and ask the question!

Cheers :)
 
jumbuck said:
If I was the Trade Sponsor, which I am, I would send me an email at my Halton address or alternatively phone me up and ask the question!

Cheers :)
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Good call, shame I'm out in 6 months or I may have fired a few at you. That said, you (or your post) have cast an eye over my little empire recently so I best keep quiet. :PDT_Xtremez_14:
 
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