Trade Group 1 Pay Rise

[sinnick]

He we go!! Lol.::/:DT_Xtremez_32:DT_Xtremez_25:

Seems I was doing the usual techie thing and missing out everything in between, i forgot to mention that of course the £26 million aircraft fixed itself, and that the paperwork are infact legally binding documents that Certify aircraft fit to fly.

But back to my point.....I am not having a pop at the other trades......if the RAF wants to recruit techies for the future then they need to either make it more of an attractive package or accept that people will not walk the long way around a field jumping the hurdles when they can much easier wander straight across at an angle for less effort and the same money.

 

[Pikeman]

So, Mon & Tue you were carrying out the duties of an MTD, Wed was a bit of admin and more driving, Thu you done something techie I don't understand, then chatted for a bit and on Friday you ordered some people around and inspected their work. And all this justifies you being on a higher pay band than MT and admin bods? How did your driving involve more responsibility than an MT driver's driving? How much responsibility and technical knowhow went into washing your bus? You guys have absolutely nothing to complain about![/quote]

That's part of the problem, we shouldn't have to be driving, doing our own admin. We should be able to concentrate on the techie stuff. Like Indies and vitals and our job rather than doing all the other stuff.

We screw up and a/c crashes we get hung,

pay gets screwed up or no mt to collect us from a det. Someone gets told off?

when did an adminer get Tech charged.

Just trying to show that there is a bit more of a difference.
Wonder when this'll get moved to fight club::

 

[glassestashthunderflash]

So, Mon & Tue you were carrying out the duties of an MTD, Wed was a bit of admin and more driving, Thu you done something techie I don't understand, then chatted for a bit and on Friday you ordered some people around and inspected their work. And all this justifies you being on a higher pay band than MT and admin bods? How did your driving involve more responsibility than an MT driver's driving? How much responsibility and technical knowhow went into washing your bus? You guys have absolutely nothing to complain about!

When do you do a techies job? Case closed. Stop fishing.

 

[unruly1986]

A week in the life of a Trade Group 1 SNCO.

Monday 0600 pick up minibus from MT flight and self drive 120 miles with a team to recover an aircraft.

Tuesday 0700drive back to aircraft to continue rects. By 1630 aircraft is airborne en-route home. Depart for the 120 mile drive back to base.1930 arrived back and depart for home.

Wednesday 0730 arrive for work to de-prep from the last 2 days and spend all morning sorting the paperwork ..... wash and fuel the minibus before returning it. Catch a trip to stores .... filling out paperwork for said inspections. Depart 1700.

Thursday 0730 arrive for work to co-ordinate a control restriction investigation. All day spent inspecting, liasing with industry/aircrew/Eng O, and testing to find the problem. depart 1700.

Friday 0730 arrive for work, dish out task for the mech shift. .... inspection on a tail assembly. .... have SJARS to write ....

Can i re-muster to a job that has loads less responsibility for the same money?? .... i just think equality of responsibility should be a major factor in scaling.


So, Mon & Tue you were carrying out the duties of an MTD, Wed was a bit of admin and more driving, Thu you done something techie I don't understand, then chatted for a bit and on Friday you ordered some people around and inspected their work. And all this justifies you being on a higher pay band than MT and admin bods? How did your driving involve more responsibility than an MT driver's driving? How much responsibility and technical knowhow went into washing your bus? You guys have absolutely nothing to complain about!

Completely agree.

As for

`That's half the problem, TG 1&2 shouldn't be harmonised with other techies in other TG's. I'm not saying that TG 1&2 techies are better than others but the standard they are expected to work to are much higher. Fact.`

When you say a higher standard what do you mean exactly? What can you guys be doing other than making the aircraft serviceable? Other `less worthy` (according to you) techie trades work on kit that are essential in enabling aircraft to fly, generators to get the things started, airfield navaids so they know where to land, etc.

 

[Downsizer]

I thought TG2 no longer exists? Isn't it just TG1 for AC trades now...

Which, lets be honest, are the only important techies anywayDT_Xtremez_31:

 

[billy bollox]

I thought TG2 no longer exists? Isn't it just TG1 for AC trades now...

Which, lets be honest, are the only important techies anywayDT_Xtremez_31:

HURRAH !!!!DT_Xtremez_28:

 

[glassestashthunderflash]

Completely agree.

As for

`That's half the problem, TG 1&2 shouldn't be harmonised with other techies in other TG's. I'm not saying that TG 1&2 techies are better than others but the standard they are expected to work to are much higher. Fact.`

When you say a higher standard what do you mean exactly? What can you guys be doing other than making the aircraft serviceable? Other `less worthy` (according to you) techie trades work on kit that are essential in enabling aircraft to fly, generators to get the things started, airfield navaids so they know where to land, etc.

At what point did I say 'less worthy'? Thank you.

Genrators to get them started? Well, they're helpful but most aircraft can start without them if need be.

Naviads? Just that, aids, not essential.

What I'm trying to say is that the risks are higher and that must, and does, lead to tighter legislation, standards of work, functional testing, routine maintenance etc. I've seen some of the methods use to fix GSE and quite frankly, it just wouldn't cut the mustard as aircraft work.

What you're essentially saying is that all engineers, regardless of what they do, should get paid the same. Ok, so does a painter and decorator get paid the same as an artist? No. But why not? They both paint! I'll tell you why, because one is working to higher standards than the other.


I stress, techies are not better than others. I refer back to my post here.

I really hope this doesn't turn in to another bun fight. As I said earlier, just look at the civvie world. Aircraft engineers are amongst the highest paid of all engineering jobs, they certainly get paid more than a car mechanic or plant engineer. Why should this be different in the RAF?

 

[Mightierthan]

But back to my point.....I am not having a pop at the other trades......if the RAF wants to recruit techies for the future then they need to either make it more of an attractive package or accept that people will not walk the long way around a field jumping the hurdles when they can much easier wander straight across at an angle for less effort and the same money.

How much more attractive can the package be? Most techies seem to walk around with sideburns down to their jaws, wear any old t-shirt as part of their uniform, often have a night shift which consists being in work for 2 hours and has regular tea-breaks along with someone to cook lard butties etc for them in the crewroom. Oh aye, and their own sqn bars of course with cheap ale.

 

[spanners]

How much more attractive can the package be? Most techies seem to walk around with sideburns down to their jaws, wear any old t-shirt as part of their uniform, often have a night shift which consists being in work for 2 hours and has regular tea-breaks along with someone to cook lard butties etc for them in the crewroom. Oh aye, and their own sqn bars of course with cheap ale.

Your fishing yeah?


Why, oh why do we always believe all the rumours of pay increases? Great if it happens, not holding my breathe though.

 

[Mightierthan]

Your fishing yeah?


It just all seems a bit silly to me. Just coz scribblies will get higher pay doesn't mean techies pay is worth less, or their job is less important. Techies seem to be the Alex Ferguson of the RAF; always got something to whinge about no matter how rosy their lives are.

 

[3wheeledtechie]

The mechanics of amending the payroll program is the easy part - operational allowance was introduced almost overnight, for example.

Where it is difficult is getting all the interested people to sign off on the policy, which would of necessity include the other Service chiefs. The RN are smarting from the further delays to their aircraft carriers, how likely is the First Sea Lord to agree to the £5M (guesstimated) needed for 2000 RAF techies to get an 8% pay rise? What about techies in the AAC and FAA? I can't see Air Troopers being paid more than Sappers or Craftsmen so that would mean the RE and REME also get this supposed pay rise. If REME get it, what about our own Gen Techs?

It will be great if it happens, but for the time being I am sceptical.

Air Trooper is an AAC rank as I understand it, and does not undertake any kind of fault finding. If any green colleagues would qualify it would be REME craftsmen of the appropriate trades.

 

[MontyPlumbs]

Air Trooper is an AAC rank as I understand it, and does not undertake any kind of fault finding. If any green colleagues would qualify it would be REME craftsmen of the appropriate trades.

AAC only provide the pan trash. The REME do all the maintenance. That's as far as I always understood it.

 

[FOMz]

Has anone considered that Techies 'could'get there own pay 'spine' similar to how NCA do.........


Not that it will happen, but that would give the mechanism for them to recieve a different payscale from the other trades on the higher pay scale.

 

[True Blue Jack]

AAC only provide the pan trash. The REME do all the maintenance. That's as far as I always understood it.

I've no idea how it works in the AAC; my point was that it is not as simple as creating a new pay band just for RAF TG1. Targeted retention incentives like those introduced for Fftr/Gnr may be more likely but I think the most likely scenario is that the recession will do enough for recruitment and retention that the powers that be will not see a need to do anything further.

 

[wobbly]

Lets stop the trade bashing and do what the lad asked and stop the inter trade bitching, it's so fooking boring and has been done to death. Yes I'm ****ed off that an adminer gets the same as me but then again fair play to him. Now how the fook do I remuster into admin so I don't have to be out in minus 10 at 03:00 working my tits off after 23 years in the mob?

 

[MingMong]

The recession isn't going to last forever (hopefully) and will only give the RAF short term breathing space. They soon have to wake up and realise that they are underpaying TG 1 & 2 relative to civvy street.

The recession hasn't changed my plans to leave next year, and there are far more people I know who are still going ahead with leaving than there are changing their minds about it.

 

[Creative]

Has anone considered that Techies 'could'get there own pay 'spine' similar to how NCA do.........

FOMz, not all NCA are on the Professional Aviator Spine. This is the same pay spine as the Pilots and WSO's but they are capped at level 20 which equates to about £58500 per annum for a Master. For a start they need to be a FS or MACr and they are selected at the same time as the promotion board. The numbers are limited as it is an expensive option for the RAF especially when you combine it with the new pension scheme. A MACr leaving today on the highest level will enjoy a Pension of £30000 a year plus £90,000 gratuity. So you can see how expensive it is.
So I don't know how it could work for the Technical trades.

 

[FOMz]

No, I meant a similar sytem to the PAS, where techies are taken out of the mainstream Higher/Lower payscale.

 

[Sospan]

FOMz, not all NCA are on the Professional Aviator Spine. This is the same pay spine as the Pilots and WSO's but they are capped at level 20 which equates to about £58500 per annum for a Master. For a start they need to be a FS or MACr and they are selected at the same time as the promotion board. The numbers are limited as it is an expensive option for the RAF especially when you combine it with the new pension scheme. A MACr leaving today on the highest level will enjoy a Pension of £30000 a year plus £90,000 gratuity. So you can see how expensive it is.
So I don't know how it could work for the Technical trades.

Thats one expensive T maker! If A Tech Eng (Techie Admin) were also on that pay bad we would blow the defense budget...

 

[Creative]

Sorry mate but NCA are on pay 2000 like the rest of the RAF. They are on the high pay band though. The only other pay spine is the Professional Aviator spine as described above.
Are you talking about flying pay perhaps? IF you are then the payments range form £6 to £19 per day.