Tranche 2

5 days to go til tranche 2 is announced.....whoop whoop.
Are you going to apply?
I understand tranche 3 for the raf is cancelled anyone else hear that?

 

[Weebl]

What it means is that a lot of the 2nd line jobs that haven't yet been civilianised should be looked at.

Yes, because civilianising blue suit jobs has always saved money and improved efficiency while never, ever impacting on output or flexibility.

 

[MontyPlumbs]

What it means is that a lot of the 2nd line jobs that haven't yet been civilianised should be looked at.

Great swathes of them already have, and all that happens is the same guys leave, put on a civvy pair of overalls and go back to the same job on more money. it's been happening in the Chinook world for ages now.

 

[Weebl]

Great swathes of them already have, and all that happens is the same guys leave, put on a civvy pair of overalls and go back to the same job on more money. it's been happening in the Chinook world for ages now.

And the best bit is, that when the RAF need overtime doing, or extra people to deploy to sort out an unforeseen situation, or a bit of a push to get something done, the company can cheerfully tell it get bent because it is 'not in the contract'

That is good though, because they saved 47p a year doing it.

(Only short term though, because in a few years when all the experienced technicians with pensions have gone they will have to pay proper money to a proper company to get somebody in who knows what they are doing)

 

[muttywhitedog]

Utter bollocks. OOA turnaround for Corporal armourers on the HOCU was 2 years.

Sorry - I was talking about the Aircraft Engineering Tradesmen ie the ones that end up as A Eng Tech if they are good enough - armourers are different.

Perhaps Ady E-Flog will be along shortly to tell us all when his last OOA was.....

 

[Stevienics]

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9015064/Army-redundancies-to-roll-on-for-many-years.html

Philip Hammond, the Defence Secretary:

"prioritising ruthlessly, specialising aggressively and collaborating unsentimentally". (= purple helmet)

 

[ady eflog]

Sorry - I was talking about the Aircraft Engineering Tradesmen ie the ones that end up as A Eng Tech if they are good enough - armourers are different.

Perhaps Ady E-Flog will be along shortly to tell us all when his last OOA was.....

Having served time on 2 of her majestys carriers and been on countless dets on sqn's I've never in 21 years done an OOA. Now that I am a chief you automatically get an OOA after 12 months in post. I applied last year to do one but It got pushed back till October this year.

 

[MontyPlumbs]

Having served time on 2 of her majestys carriers and been on countless dets on sqn's I've never in 21 years done an OOA. Now that I am a chief you automatically get an OOA after 12 months in post. I applied last year to do one but It got pushed back till October this year.

Having battled with manning (in the days when you could speak to the gods as a lowly SAC) to actually get an OOA I can sympathise. It took 4 attempts at volunteering before I finally got an AO (three days after I'd PVR'd- go figure) and then it was to the Falklands!! Thankfully, common sense prevailed and I was sent somewhere more useful.

At the end of the day we have these 'career managers' to use the pool of personnel effectively. Unfortunately they appear about as much use as a condom machine in the Vatican. Certainly the two on the Weapons desk at the time were a pair of muppets who thought they were the most important people in the RAF.

 

[FootTapper]

Certainly the two on the Weapons desk at the time were a pair of muppets who thought they were the most important people in the RAF.

A few years ago I phoned up the desk to volunteer for an EOD tour as I was Q'd and current, and the lad who'd just received his AO for it barely had time for all the Q courses before he needed to be on the flight..

You'd think that sort of thing would be welcomed. Instead I got a bollocking on the phone for trying to "jump the queue"

 

[Tyson]

"Utter bollocks. OOA turnaround for Corporal armourers on the HOCU was 2 years."

I think those numbers may be rigger/atm Monty, I'm a Cpl and I've been in over 15 years and haven't done one yet. Although I was 1st line for about 7-8 years I think I only got my 90 days in (is the 90 days thing still going?) in 2 of those years. I've never been to the Falklands, Iraq or Afghan but have spent cumulative months (maybe years now) in Cyprus, Italy, Incirlik, PSAB, Bahrain, States, Australia, Ascension etc. Not sure if I've been lucky, slipped through the net or just average.

Any thoughts from an Admin/manning type, am I an exception or more the norm?

 

[Tyson]

Should have read a bit further before replying, Mutty seems to have answered my point, Ady seems to have done even better than me.

 

[seymour badminton raquet]

Should have read a bit further before replying, Mutty seems to have answered my point, Ady seems to have done even better than me.

I have beat Ady by a couple of years. Sgt ATM, been in 23 and a bit years and have never been sent anywhere OOA. Not my fault just never got the call.

 

[muttywhitedog]

Turnround Times for TG1:

WO - 4 to 8 years
FS - 5-10 years

ATM:

Chf - 7 yrs (Ady - how come you have hit the top of this list already, or was it over 7 years since you last went on board?)
Sgt - 12 yrs
Cpl - 12 yrs
SAC - 9 yrs

ATAv:

Chf - 8-10 yrs
Sgt - 6-13 yrs
Cpl - 6-13 yrs
SAC - 5-10 yrs

That says to me that there are a lot of 2nd Line Posts that could be civilianised, leaving the vast majority of TG1 on the deployable units. Its entirely possible that the Career Managers will look to the RN model and give you a frontline tour, followed by a "shore" job.

I'd be very very surprised if TG1 isnt hit hard tomorrow.

 

[ady eflog]

Turnround Times for TG1:

WO - 4 to 8 years
FS - 5-10 years

ATM:

Chf - 7 yrs (Ady - how come you have hit the top of this list already, or was it over 7 years since you last went on board?)
Sgt - 12 yrs
Cpl - 12 yrs
SAC - 9 yrs

ATAv:

Chf - 8-10 yrs
Sgt - 6-13 yrs
Cpl - 6-13 yrs
SAC - 5-10 yrs

That says to me that there are a lot of 2nd Line Posts that could be civilianised, leaving the vast majority of TG1 on the deployable units. Its entirely possible that the Career Managers will look to the RN model and give you a frontline tour, followed by a "shore" job.

I'd be very very surprised if TG1 isnt hit hard tomorrow.

Its policy to give every Chief 12 months grace then give them an OOA regardless of when they did one last. The Manning cell confirmed this after 2 friends got it at the 12 month point. I phoned up and voluenteered as the only posts for my rank/trade are Oman and F.I. My last qualifying op was 1999!

 

[Treehugger]

I'd be very very surprised if TG1 isnt hit hard tomorrow.

Let's hope so! They can give me the cash in 1p pieces if they like!

 

[Billy Whizz]

Its policy to give every Chief 12 months grace then give them an OOA regardless of when they did one last. The Manning cell confirmed this after 2 friends got it at the 12 month point. I phoned up and voluenteered as the only posts for my rank/trade are Oman and F.I. My last qualifying op was 1999!

Can pretty much agree with that - arrived at Wyton with my CT and got the OOA notification with my arrival chit - so did many others.

 

[Weebl]

Turnround Times for TG1:

WO - 4 to 8 years
FS - 5-10 years

ATM:

Chf - 7 yrs (Ady - how come you have hit the top of this list already, or was it over 7 years since you last went on board?)
Sgt - 12 yrs
Cpl - 12 yrs
SAC - 9 yrs

ATAv:

Chf - 8-10 yrs
Sgt - 6-13 yrs
Cpl - 6-13 yrs
SAC - 5-10 yrs

That says to me that there are a lot of 2nd Line Posts that could be civilianised, leaving the vast majority of TG1 on the deployable units. Its entirely possible that the Career Managers will look to the RN model and give you a frontline tour, followed by a "shore" job.

I'd be very very surprised if TG1 isnt hit hard tomorrow.

Does this take into account the fact that the huge majority of TG1 OOAs are as formed units so there are very few DWR slots to go around?

I have done 23 years, have spent around 4 years in the middle east as well as about 2 years elsewhere either as Squadron detachments or aircraft crew and have never actually been DWR (I was pinged once but the post was disestablished before anybody ever got there)

Looking at it from a pure numbers point of view I am dragging those averages upwards, and it looks like we (TG1) hardly ever deploy. That is not true.

 

[feckinG RANT]

All this OAA is a bit off topic, so sorry for adding,but aside from that I thought if you did 80 days consecutively, or 90 days in 12 month period, then that's a credit for OOA. I looked up the order on this a while back and that's what I recall.

I'm an ATM who has almost done 22, never done an OOA. I asked PSF when I was due one and I got told you (and the Sgt used the term OOA) the last time you did an OOA was in 2002. This was when I was a JT on a Tonka Sqn, so it would have been the 90 days in 12 month thing, but as he referred to it as "an OOA" then I'm guessing that there's no difference how it's gained (be it 90 days in 12 months or an actual OOA) as long as you've a credit then that's that.

As for turn round time, simple fact is that there’s not many roles for TG1 outside of FU dets.

 

[muttywhitedog]

Strange...all the recently promoted Chiefs that I personally know have not been nominated for an OOA, but every single one of them had done some serious amount of time in Kandahar with the Harrier Dets in the past 6 years. Ady has already said that his last OOA was 1999 (12 yrs ago), so I suspect that he was very close to the top of the DWR list for Sgt ATM, hence a 12 month grace when he got promoted because he was moving into a rank that has a TRT of only 7 years, so naturally he'd be at the top of that list.

Billy Whizz - Do you fit into that category, or is my theory completely wrong?

 

[Billy Whizz]

Strange...all the recently promoted Chiefs that I personally know have not been nominated for an OOA, but every single one of them had done some serious amount of time in Kandahar with the Harrier Dets in the past 6 years. Ady has already said that his last OOA was 1999 (12 yrs ago), so I suspect that he was very close to the top of the DWR list for Sgt ATM, hence a 12 month grace when he got promoted because he was moving into a rank that has a TRT of only 7 years, so naturally he'd be at the top of that list.

Billy Whizz - Do you fit into that category, or is my theory completely wrong?

I hadn't done a 90 day OOA for a long time (plenty of Sqn Dets etc) but still went on what was my 3rd one, before a colleague who had never gone in 22+ years, until he got posted as a CT and replaced me.

I always thought it was a given when sent on to a DE&S posting - IPT etc.

A CT where I work now had his full quota of OOA days but on posting to this DE&S post he was told he was going OOA straight away - within his first year in Post.

 

[Billy Whizz]

All this OAA is a bit off topic, so sorry for adding,but aside from that I thought if you did 80 days consecutively, or 90 days in 12 month period, then that's a credit for OOA. I looked up the order on this a while back and that's what I recall.

I'm an ATM who has almost done 22, never done an OOA. I asked PSF when I was due one and I got told you (and the Sgt used the term OOA) the last time you did an OOA was in 2002. This was when I was a JT on a Tonka Sqn, so it would have been the 90 days in 12 month thing, but as he referred to it as "an OOA" then I'm guessing that there's no difference how it's gained (be it 90 days in 12 months or an actual OOA) as long as you've a credit then that's that.

As for turn round time, simple fact is that there’s not many roles for TG1 outside of FU dets.

Eng Ops seems to be where most Heavy CTs end up - so at least 9 post a year down south, plus a couple of Standards/QA type posts too.