British Sailors released from Iran

Just over the wire.

15 British Sailors have been captured by Iranian Forces while on duties in the Gulf.

No more deatils yet.

 

[Tashy_Man]

The UN Security Council has unanimously voted in favour of new sanctions against Iran for its refusal to suspend its nuclear enrichment programme.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/world/middle_east/6492139.stm

Anyone think this will help the plight of our troops ?? I don't !!

 

[True Blue Jack]

Anyone think this will help the plight of our troops ?? I don't !!

They couldn't really do anything else, could they? Before long, possibly as soon as tomorrow morning, the Iranians will release a video of the marines "confessing". That's when they will let their demands be known.

 

[Tashy_Man]

They couldn't really do anything else, could they?

No, I agree....BUT, it only takes one nutter over there (and i'm guessing there will be a fair few nutters with itchy trigger fingers) to feel outraged at the UN and it's rulings and then things get nasty......

I really hope not ........DT_Xtremez_09:

 

[CodeMonkey]

Deja vu anyone, the fact that this has happened twice now is more than suspicious!
Once could be taken as maybe they made a mistake, twice is getting suspicious.

Perhaps next time we are enforcing un resolutions we should have a destroyer + harriers + cruise missile capable sub nearby, Unless the temperature in hell has dropped below 0 degrees these men and woman were not in iranian waters. They are being used for one purpose only and that is point scoring. Time to refit a vulcan or a TSR 2 coupled with blue steel. (the point i'm trying to make here is that when our troops do this they need the support close to hand just in case).

The president Mahmoud Ahmadinejad is mouthy puppet and the real runners of the country are the ayatollas. They will play political games and use this sort of incident to their advantage. Iran wants the west to fail in the stabilisation of Iraq, the next step will be Isreal and then the rest of the middle east.

Unless the whole world get together and put a stop to this sort of behavior the middle east will get worse.

 

[vim_fuego]

This could also be tied in the a fall in popularity for the Iranian leaders...George Jones, political editor for the Telegraph has been reviewing the Sundays on BBC Breakfast this morning and he brought this fact up so I did a bit of digging (it's a quiet day):

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/14640273/site/newsweek/

http://www.ft.com/cms/s/a62b2332-b8ac-11db-be2e-0000779e2340.html

This kind of thing whips up a frenzy within the unwashed in Iran that takes the heat off seemingly unpopular policies...The hostage taking now nicely ties in with a public holiday (today or tomorrow I think) in Iran...The religous police have had time to get around the mosques and whip up some 'mobs' to take to the street to shout and reduce the numbers of British and American flags in the world...Making sure to not waste good meths and cloth if no international press are in the vicinity...

Obviously it's a suck it and see situation but it will be interesting to see if George has got it right...

 

[mad_mo]

I browsed to see what the Iranian Defence Ministry's propoganda was on the incident.

Not exactly open are they!

http://www.mod.ir/

 

[DrunkenMonki]

I think i'd be sh!tting myself if i was in that boarding party. The nutters would have to be daft to hurt them, wouldn't they? Bloody aweful situation.

 

[True Blue Jack]

I'll admit to being worried at first that with 15 captives the Iranians might think that they could afford to send a very definite message without damaging their bargaining power. Trumped up it may be, but I think it is a good sign that they are going down a "civilised" route.

Iran considers charges against sailors

They still haven't said what they want in exchange for the sailors' safe return. I think it has to be "Stay out of our nuclear programme" or "Get out of Iraq".

 

[The Bishop]

I personnaly think the Sailors and Marines will be ok. A little "roughed up" maybe just to prove a point. At the end of the day the Iranians cannot gain anything out of hurting them. The jinglies are probably taking all their kit to pieces for inspection, when they have finished, our people and their kit will be handed back. It's all posturing I hope........(Fingers crossed).

 

[Tashy_Man]

our people and their kit will be handed back

I hope our guys are returned ASAP along with everyone else and couldn't really give a rats ar$e about their kit........

BUT...

....for their sake i hope they do get the kit back 'cause knowing this government they'd charge them for lost kit....i can just see the deductions on JPA now.....

Crack on guys, be safe....DT_Xtremez_09:

 

[MrMasher]

Iran have made the UK look very weak.

I think you'll find our current government did that already, Iran have just highlighted the fact.

If the yanks have 100% proof and so do we that the Iranians have poached our 14 lads and 1 lass from Iraqi waters get the UN involved. Not sanctions and pishy talking through ambassadors. Our PM and the UN main man speak direct to Irans PM and tell him to give them back or face the consequences. Take the bloody staff from the Iranian embassy in the UK! See how they like it!

All this pussy footing around, COME ON!!!! It's inevitable that at some point we'll be at proper loggerheads with Iran. Look what happened with Israel and Lebanon when some soldiers got kidknapped........................

 

[True Blue Jack]

Look what happened with Israel and Lebanon when some soldiers got kidknapped........................

You can't really compare the 2 situations. The Israeli soldiers were in Lebanon when they were kidnapped, and Israel was widely condemned for its "aggressive diplomacy". IIRC they never got their men back.

If our guys had not been moved to Tehran, I think SF would already have tried to get them out. It would be like the away fixture of the Iranian Embassy siege in 1981! We are a while away from a larger UN-sanctioned operation, although I agree with every day that passes it is much more likely.

 

[Tashy_Man]

Just been watching the news on ITV...correspondant outside number 10 talking to the studio..

Studio: Well waht are the options available to the government
Corr: well only one...diplomacy

Good to see they are covering all the angles !!

FFS at the mo we are still an ARMED FORCE (only just i'll grant you)...lets start posturing and making some threats.......just don't let blair make them cause then they know they'll be safe ...

Come on guys crack on.............DT_Xtremez_09:

 

[Craig855s]

im getting a bit worried about all this as i can see blair mouthing off and i dont think iran will take kindly to this,and may just say "bring it on" in which case we'll end up in a PROPER WAR,sure the americans would jump in and shock and awe there ass but it only takes one ICBM or bomber to get over our mainland and we could have some real problems

yes iran and most of the middle east need to be tought how to play the game, but please,not on my watch DT_Xtremez_21:

 

[OldEddie]

Sailors

Sailors

DT_Xtremez_28: Look guys, think if Iran had attacked Ireland with a coalition because they did not agree with their government and Iranian gun boats were patroling off our shores between Ireland and Blackpool, stopping shipping etc. What would our position be !!! We would be watchful. Yes the Iranians have used us again because the Americains would have shoDT_Xtremez_28: t first and asked questions later; we are not like that and Iran knows this; of all the countries in this world the USA will only take notice of us.

im getting a bit worried about all this as i can see blair mouthing off and i dont think iran will take kindly to this,and may just say "bring it on" in which case we'll end up in a PROPER WAR,sure the americans would jump in and shock and awe there ass but it only takes one ICBM or bomber to get over our mainland and we could have some real problems

yes iran and most of the middle east need to be tought how to play the game, but please,not on my watch DT_Xtremez_21:

 

[MrMasher]

You can't really compare the 2 situations. The Israeli soldiers were in Lebanon when they were kidnapped, and Israel was widely condemned for its "aggressive diplomacy". IIRC they never got their men back.

If our guys had not been moved to Tehran, I think SF would already have tried to get them out. It would be like the away fixture of the Iranian Embassy siege in 1981! We are a while away from a larger UN-sanctioned operation, although I agree with every day that passes it is much more likely.

Don't be pedantic.
I am not comparing the 2 situations.
It was simply an example of what another country has done in a similar situation, ie, they had their people illegally kidnapped regardless of how or why.
Israel may well have been condemned for it's agressive diplomacy (if you call an all out offensive diplomacy?) but did any of the goaters see it and think to themsleves, "good on you Israel, stand up to the fcukers"? I know its what I thought. And yes, they went in very heavy handed, but fook me, they got the message didnt they?

 

[True Blue Jack]

Don't be pedantic.
I am not comparing the 2 situations.
It was simply an example of what another country has done in a similar situation, ie, they had their people illegally kidnapped regardless of how or why.
Israel may well have been condemned for it's agressive diplomacy (if you call an all out offensive diplomacy?) but did any of the goaters see it and think to themsleves, "good on you Israel, stand up to the fcukers"? I know its what I thought. And yes, they went in very heavy handed, but fook me, they got the message didnt they?

Israel delivered its message, but at what cost? All the advances of the Middle East peace process wiped out in a couple of weeks. The Israeli soldiers were not illegally kidnapped, they were captured conducting a covert operation on the wrong side of the border. More importantly, Israel never got its men back and that has to be our objective - however it's done.

An all out unilateral offensive against Iran would have dire consequences for any number of reasons. Apart from anything else we don't have the people, equipment or political will to commit to a 3rd war, and Iran must surely know this. A rescue mission by SF cannot go ahead until we know where our guys are. The UN may condemn the kidnappings in the days ahead but the security council (read French & Russians) will not authorise military action against a sovereign nation for the sake of 15 guys who are not reported to be in any physical danger. This leaves us with the diplomatic option.

 

[mad_mo]

The Israeli soldiers were not illegally kidnapped, they were captured conducting a covert operation on the wrong side of the border.

I'd look at it as a covert op into lebanese territory means you are illegally there!.

 

[I Look Like Kevin Costner]

Rescue by SF??

Rescue by SF??

Remember an SF operation need spot on intellegence, planning and the resources to do it. The Yanks had this in 1980 and totally blew it.

Where are the 15? Somewhere in a city of 10 million! Forget it!

The Iranian will release the guys in time. Its worrying and uncomfortable for them and their families, but it is not in the best interests of Iran to do any real harm to them.

However, when they are released, Naval proceedure should be if the IRG try a stunt like that again, The ROE goes war level in the response to the threat.

 

[firestorm]

Is there a difference between kidnap and "extra-ordinary rendition?"