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Maa & trimble

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Downsizer said:
Getting back to the core issue, where I work an email has recently been sent round listing all the speeding offenders by name and the percentage they were above the speedlimit, but not the actual speedlimit they broke. The WC then highlighted his arbitrary few to be MAA'd. Thats not right IMO.
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I'd be looking to redress this as a beach of the the DPA.

More seriously I'm guessing the driver of the vehicle does not have real time access to the Trimble indicated speed so surely the RAF have to prove that the individual knew they were speeding. I'm aware most speedos under read, however, with no proof is just guess work.

FL you say that others are seeing what they want and bringing their own interpretations, true, but so are you, you've gone quiet on the illegal comments, told the op to take it on the chin and threatened him that by standing up for himself he'd be in more trouble than he is now.

This don't rock the boat attitude allows poor management to thrive resulting in individuals suffering as per the op, whilst similar transgressors are let off. This isn't about fighting the system, the system always wins, it's about making sure the system is worth having and fit for purpose.
 
Does anyone think it may be interesting to bang in a freedom of information request to identify by rank the number of people "caught" speeding by trimble and the subsequent disciplinary or administrative action taken, again broken down by rank. It could be a very interesting read. I might just do this. There are several restrictions (financial and time taken to investigate for example) placed in this process so I will only request it for a select number of Units. If you want yours included PM me.
 
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Maa & trimble

busby1971 said:
FL you say that others are seeing what they want and bringing their own interpretations, true, but so are you, you've gone quiet on the illegal comments, told the op to take it on the chin and threatened him that by standing up for himself he'd be in more trouble than he is now.

This don't rock the boat attitude allows poor management to thrive resulting in individuals suffering as per the op, whilst similar transgressors are let off. This isn't about fighting the system, the system always wins, it's about making sure the system is worth having and fit for purpose.
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No busby I didn't threaten anyone. I haven't gone quiet on anything for any other reason than that has been said and surely doesn't need repeating. As others have pointed out, the points I originally made were correct.

The don't rock the boat advice was again to attempt to help the OP see that whilst he may have been able to fight the speeding if that were the only issue, doing so could bring other failings (paperwork) into play and possibly make things worse. Again as it stands the other issue has been raised anyway.

The interpretations I referred to were not of the OPs situation but of the answers I have given to the points addressed to me. Again you appear to simply confirm this.

I have again and again had to repeat myself and I see little in the way of new ground being covered here tbh. If the OP seeks any further advice or anyone raises any new points then great.


This message was sent using my thumb.
 
That freedom of info request you refer to would help me no end wouldn't it? At the end of the day, if I knew about the amount of people slipping through the net unlike myself, that must be more ammo for me, right? Also my main gripe for the MAA was if I was to get into a vehicle next week and see examples of the FMT1001 being inaccurate and incomplete, how do you think I will feel, then the week after and the week after that, it just doesn't sit with me tbh. I had a call late yesterday from an officer pretty much asking me if I had seriously thought about the consequences of asking for a formal review, almost telling me to back down as it were, it's my bloody right to have a review so why even attempt to talk me out of it. I sensed alot of flapping late yesterday.
 
delboy said:
That freedom of info request you refer to would help me no end wouldn't it? At the end of the day, if I knew about the amount of people slipping through the net unlike myself, that must be more ammo for me, right? Also my main gripe for the MAA was if I was to get into a vehicle next week and see examples of the FMT1001 being inaccurate and incomplete, how do you think I will feel, then the week after and the week after that, it just doesn't sit with me tbh. I had a call late yesterday from an officer pretty much asking me if I had seriously thought about the consequences of asking for a formal review, almost telling me to back down as it were, it's my bloody right to have a review so why even attempt to talk me out of it. I sensed alot of flapping late yesterday.
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IMHO they don't want it to go to review possibly because they have realised something isn't quite as black and white as made out.
 
Maa & trimble

You are well within your rights to question the way you feel you have been singled out. I would ask the officer for a chat where you can tell him what exactly you see as being wrong in this case. I would also make clear that you want him to take you to P1 after you have had your chat. They are the ones who know the process inside out and will be able to advise you on what options you have and whether or not they think you have grounds. Again I can only speak for the P1 sections where I have been but all have been approachable.

I'd also mention to the officer that you feel that you are being singled out etc as this should make him think very carefully about how he puts his advice across.

Main point: speak to P1 and put your point across in a constructive manner and please be aware of barrack block lawyers. I have seen too many fall foul of bad advice from those with 'good gen'. It's amazing how readily they tell people to take it all the way when it doesn't involve them at all.


This message was sent using my thumb.
 
Some times it can be hard to weed out the good advice of well intentioned colleagues from those who will egg you on, that doesn't make everyone a Barack room lawyer.

At the end of the day the op knows that there are official documents that can prove that others have committed similar transgressions but have not had similar treatment, I think he has a strong hand, judging by the late call so do the RAF.

It would be great to know that the management will learn from this and correct this potentially unfair treatment without any detriment to the individual, after all there's always a first time for everything.

I would also question the call from the officer where the op was basically threatened as others close ranks, what is the point of having a formal review process if it's use results in greater sanction, shouldn't happen as some real layers found out in the courts, McMillan v Airedale NHS Foundation Trust.
 
busby1971 said:
I'm aware most speedos under read, however, with no proof is just guess work.
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Minor point mate, no they don't They over-read, they are not allowed to under-read by law else you end up with precisely the situation we are trying to avoid, i.e. someone is travelling faster than what their speedo tells them.
 
Downsizer said:
Was the audit carried out by a civvy perchance?
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I'm not sure mate, there are quite a few names thrown around, WC has been a big player in it, not sure if he told a civvg to do the audit but why that exact month? What about the month before and the month after?
 
Civvy Police have to issue a NIP for speeding within 6 weeks of the offence occurring, surely there is a time frame for the military authorities?
What is Trimble please? I left in 2001.
 
Dave-exfairy said:
What is Trimble please? I left in 2001.
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It's a little black box that sits on the dashboard containing (An educated guess) a GPS tracker and accelerometers for acceleration / deceleration and lateral forces.

It also has a traffic light on it which changes depending on how you drive:

Green - Good, you're a paradigm of legal driving greatness!

Yellow: Woah steady on there Cowboy, OC MT's ******** is starting to itch!

Red: Ok Senna, you're for it now! (unless you have a commission..........)
 
Spearmint said:
It's a little black box that sits on the dashboard containing (An educated guess) a GPS tracker and accelerometers for acceleration / deceleration and lateral forces.

It also has a traffic light on it which changes depending on how you drive:

Green - Good, you're a paradigm of legal driving greatness!

Yellow: Woah steady on there Cowboy, OC MT's ******** is starting to itch!

Red: Ok Senna, you're for it now! (unless you have a commission..........)
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Which fuse does it come off?
 
Spearmint said:
It's a little black box that sits on the dashboard containing (An educated guess) a GPS tracker and accelerometers for acceleration / deceleration and lateral forces.

It also has a traffic light on it which changes depending on how you drive:

Green - Good, you're a paradigm of legal driving greatness!

Yellow: Woah steady on there Cowboy, OC MT's ******** is starting to itch!

Red: Ok Senna, you're for it now! (unless you have a commission..........)
Click to expand...


Just curious, If you tend to wear heavy boots, for both pedals, but stay within the law speed-wise what do they do??
 
Omerta said:
Just curious, If you tend to wear heavy boots, for both pedals, but stay within the law speed-wise what do they do??
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It all depends on how anal your MT staff are, there is no blanket answer to it, they did release some guidence but that obviously isn't being implemented correctly. The sceptic in me suggests it's also rank related on punishment but they tell you it isn't, bulllsh1t.
 
It has to have a power source, pull fuse, job done.
Some police forces have fitted their cars with similar things, but some can be as simple as if you're involved with an incident then you press a button on the box and it saves the inputs that came 5 mins or so prior to the incident.
 
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