AIP mispayment

[Mug?]

Saw it coming

Saw it coming

Quote Originally Posted by delboy View Post
Is it not a clear cut case that if someone put 2 AIPs in as an SAC 1 being a BTEC and the other an NVQ level 3 then it was always stated that they are classed as Q-PI-A and Q-PI-B, and the rules were only 1 at different ranks if this case? I only ask as I know a few people who did this and they are paying for it now.

Can't be that clear cut mate; the majority of cases are those who put 2 in at SAC.

We were actively encouraged to do it when leaving Cosford.

Don't know details, neither do most on here by the look of it.

I knew a lot of guys who did that and it was pretty much against the rules and they knew it but it was going through. So no sympathy for them and they should be held up to pay it (plus interest I reckon!)
However,
Those who got stung with the wrong qual or level or fell foul of who paid and relevance to trade etc have a case though.

 

[Max Reheat]

They've gone after my Mrs for £6800 for GYH, the JSP changed in Feb 2010 stating the 5S married cat can't claim and we never noticed. A1 Staneval approved it every year but that makes little difference as we have no email trail

 

[busby1971]

There's bound to be a mix of innocents and those who chanced it a bit, always are, I've just been involved in an audit of an allowance with my current employer and recovered the best part of £50k from about 20 guys. Not one of them put up a fight and it was mainly a mix of claiming when my entitled or they should have notified a change in circumstances, now for a couple the amounts were small and could have got lost in our complicated payslips but one guy was getting £800 a month, unlikely he didn't realise.

 

[busby1971]

By the way I'm not saying every one was guilty and I think those that were approved by the TS should be honoured.

 

[Highflyer]

The thing that everyone has a gripe with is that we were under he impression that we were entitled to the pay increase. It was not just a case of "get in ive got another £200 in my pay packet better keep that quiet" it had been signed of and the application referenced an air publucation. ****it im going to judge rinder he knows his stuff!!

 

[busby1971]

AC I was making a comment in reference to Mugs posting, referencing how there are people out there who will try it on, which I then qualified with support for the guys who I feel have been wronged by the system, some of whom will be paying this back for a long time.

With regards power, for our guys it was a system check that found the debts and I was asked to recover the money by the payroll guys, as they don't talk to employees, I've never enjoyed doing this and never will. The only power I had was managing to mitigate the loss for some guys by finding reasons not to take the whole debt back or agreeing repayment terms that were as kind as possible.

Like any other member if I feel I have something to say I'll post whether or not I was signed on, promoted or kicked out for some heinous crime irrespective of the requirement for the comment to be agreeable to you.

 

[Squittervolts]

Like many others I have affected by the whole AIP recovery action thing and there are certainly many posts on the subject but has anyone actually had any useful information on how best to fight this case?

I've seen several references to legal bodies willing to represent individuals but what are they basing their objections on? Is there an applicable statute of limitations they are using that limits the timescale for recovery action?


Any useful information will be gladly received.

 

[busby1971]

The basis of any reasonable claim would be that you couldn't be aware that the employer made a mistake, therefore you had no reason to doubt the money was yours and spent it as such.

Whilst a mistake by your employer doesn't always mean you can keep the money, it also doesn't mean it can take it back either.

You'll need all your deuces lined up with as much evidence as possible to argue your case, I would have thought the RAF would have a hard time if it just relies on the recovery of public money argument. I'd recommend submitting a subject access request for all the paperwork related to your application.

 

[skullster704]

I'd recommend submitting a subject access request for all the paperwork related to your application.

A cynical person would surely be expecting the corporate version of "my dog ate it".

After submitting my AIP at the inception of Pay 2000 (ahem, and one) I would not be holding my breath about getting a copy- which would be a two edged sword for the RAF. "Prove I wasn't entitled..."

 

[applecruncher]

Tax implications

Tax implications

This money that they are going to try and take back.....you've paid income tax on it so there's another thing to think about. It may force people to put tax returns in to recoup the tax. It's going to be uber messy for HR and the individuals alike.
Then there's the possibility of being taken out of the higher rate of tax for some.........

 

[Fu Fu Valve]

The tax thing is a right pain in the ass.
HRs answer when i went through all this was "Tax Is your problem not ours". Which was great when I was based In Akrotiri.
I never managed to get it sorted in the end, it was to much crap to deal with while I was going trough a divorce as well.
There was zero help from HR in dealing with any of the tax issues I was just cut loose to get on with it.

 

[E E E E E E E E AR]

Has anyone on here put in an objection (other than hardship) yet, and had it accepted. Not the debt written off, just placed on hold.

Worrying April is hurtling towards us, and I want some time to get my evidence together and perhaps seek some legal advice. (Not sure if that would be a valid objection in itself!?)

 

[vauxhall1975]

£380 a moth for 1.5yrs...

£380 a moth for 1.5yrs...

Has anyone on here put in an objection (other than hardship) yet, and had it accepted. Not the debt written off, just placed on hold.

Worrying April is hurtling towards us, and I want some time to get my evidence together and perhaps seek some legal advice. (Not sure if that would be a valid objection in itself!?)

Not officially as yet but have Hr working on full breakdown of monies supposedly owed as such and a full paperwork pull to see if they have any backup at all to their claims.

Mine will be hardship case i fear but need their evidence before put words down. The box they give you is tiny anyway !! Would have to be concise to be sure...
No answer from Lawyers as yet either...


** From payment paid over 6 yrs to a full recovery in 1.5yrs is somewhat frustrating to say least. Drop us a level and the recovery would only be about 85 a month... far more sensible but then sensible and HR....


TBC

 

[Downsizer]

Been told mine won't be recovered now. Not told why, in fact not officially told at all, had my chf clerk get in touch with someone at Air Command who confirmed my debt wouldn't be recovered. Never got to put forward my arguments that my claim was legit, etc.... Strange.

 

[Stevienics]

Been told mine won't be recovered now. Not told why, in fact not officially told at all, had my chf clerk get in touch with someone at Air Command who confirmed my debt wouldn't be recovered. Never got to put forward my arguments that my claim was legit, etc.... Strange.

The moment they go to print with an official reason why your's won't be recovered, they set a legal precedent for every other claim in the same category. This is war, after all.

 

[needsabiggerfuse]

The moment they go to print with an official reason why your's won't be recovered, they set a legal precedent for every other claim in the same category. This is war, after all.

So there is a 'lottery' element to it. I can hear the legal knives being sharpened.

 

[ady eflog]

Been told mine won't be recovered now. Not told why, in fact not officially told at all, had my chf clerk get in touch with someone at Air Command who confirmed my debt wouldn't be recovered. Never got to put forward my arguments that my claim was legit, etc.... Strange.

Good luck getting it taken off your paychit!!!!!!

 

[Downsizer]

Good luck getting it taken off your paychit!!!!!!

Well it doesn't actually appear on my payslip and hasn't since all the debts were placed on hold years ago.

 

[vauxhall1975]

AIP Help

AIP Help

Any movement from anyone on this step? By signing the form - jsp 754 annex a to sect 6 Chap 2 are we admitting guilt? Because without signing that we cant officially appeal and put the debt on hold at all?

Help would be appreciated.

Has anyone on here put in an objection (other than hardship) yet, and had it accepted. Not the debt written off, just placed on hold.

Worrying April is hurtling towards us, and I want some time to get my evidence together and perhaps seek some legal advice. (Not sure if that would be a valid objection in itself!?)

 

[E E E E E E E E AR]

Any movement from anyone on this step? By signing the form - jsp 754 annex a to sect 6 Chap 2 are we admitting guilt? Because without signing that we cant officially appeal and put the debt on hold at all?

Help would be appreciated.

I've heard a few other people ask the same thing, to no avail. If you tick the box which says 'I agree that an over-issue has occurred , but object to repayment. I request waiver of the recovery.' ... are you dropping yourself in it? Dodgy as fooook!